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  3. After 50 million miles, Waymos crash a lot less than human drivers

After 50 million miles, Waymos crash a lot less than human drivers

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  • S [email protected]

    Human drivers have an extremely long tail of idiocy. Most people are good (or at least appropriately cautious) drivers, but there is a very small percentage of people who are extremely aggressive and reckless. The fact that self driving tech is never emotional, reckless or impaired pretty much guarantees that it will always statistically beat humans, even in somewhat basic forms.

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    wrote on last edited by
    #182

    It's all about the whole dunning-kruger effect where most just know nothing despite thinking otherwise, right?

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    • V [email protected]
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      wrote on last edited by
      #183

      I used to hate them for being slow and annoying. Now they drive like us and I hate them for being dicks. This morning, one of them made an insane move that only the worst Audi drivers in my area do, a massive left over a solid yellow across no stop sign with me coming right at it before it even began acceleration into the intersection.

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      • V [email protected]
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        wrote on last edited by
        #184

        Thing is, the end goal after sorting out all the bugs in the AI is no human druven cars since having both will only lead to crashes dur to AI being unable to predict a human. All the AI cars would be linked to a central system to communicate with eachother and alwats know where eachither are. Then all we have to do is make sure people only use the cross walks and traffic accudents will be solely due to idiots.

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        • L [email protected]

          How long ago was that? Last year I took a couple near Phoenix and they did great, lights or no. The hardest part was dropping me off at the front of a hotel, as people were in and out and cars were everywhere. Still didn't have issues, just slowed down to 3mph when it had 15 years left or so

          wunami@lemmy.worldW This user is from outside of this forum
          wunami@lemmy.worldW This user is from outside of this forum
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          wrote on last edited by
          #185

          just slowed down to 3mph when it had 15 years left or so

          Damn, spending 15 years in a car going 3mph sounds terrible.

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          • C [email protected]

            I hate felon musk but I honestly believe their self driving tech is safer than humans.

            Have you seen the average human? They're beyond dumb. If they're in cars it's like the majority of htem are just staring at their cell phones.

            I don't think self driving tech works in all circumstances, but I bet it is already much better than humans at most driving, especially highway driving.

            kingthrillgore@lemmy.mlK This user is from outside of this forum
            kingthrillgore@lemmy.mlK This user is from outside of this forum
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            wrote on last edited by
            #186

            Bro I saw a video of their car drive through a wall and hand the controls back to the driver. No, it absolutely is not.

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            • ? Guest

              So only drive 5 miles. I guess that’s good advice in general

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              kingthrillgore@lemmy.mlK This user is from outside of this forum
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              wrote on last edited by
              #187

              About that

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              • G [email protected]

                Thing is, the end goal after sorting out all the bugs in the AI is no human druven cars since having both will only lead to crashes dur to AI being unable to predict a human. All the AI cars would be linked to a central system to communicate with eachother and alwats know where eachither are. Then all we have to do is make sure people only use the cross walks and traffic accudents will be solely due to idiots.

                ? Offline
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                wrote on last edited by
                #188

                I doubt a central system would ever be viable, but they would certainly communicate to other nearby cars with more than just blinky lights

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                • W [email protected]

                  So fuck everyone who can't afford to live in the city?

                  Yea, I can, do, and will vote for officials that want to expand public transit. I also appreciate other efforts being taken, because I don't let perfect be the enemy of the good.

                  C This user is from outside of this forum
                  C This user is from outside of this forum
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                  wrote on last edited by
                  #189

                  So fuck everyone who can't afford to, or doesn't want to, live in the city?

                  What the hell? Were did you pull that from my comment?

                  We need to work to improve public transport everywhere. Switzerland can have timely consistent trains to tiny villages in the fucking alps. We can have it here. We need to push for it though.

                  People saying "it doesn't work for me right now so shut up" are actively harmful to the discussion. They're choosing to be in a position where it doesn't work at all (though it doesn't work well for almost anyone in America outside of DC and NYC). I'm not saying "fuck them" I'm saying "your opinion is not relevant if it's only complaining about doing better because it's bad for you right now."

                  Its like saying we shouldn't go to the moon because it's hard right now, or we shouldn't try to develop nuclear fusion technology because it's hard right now. I don't care if it's hard right now. We're discussing what could/should be.

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                  • wunami@lemmy.worldW [email protected]

                    just slowed down to 3mph when it had 15 years left or so

                    Damn, spending 15 years in a car going 3mph sounds terrible.

                    L This user is from outside of this forum
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                    wrote on last edited by
                    #190

                    Haha, yeah I didn't check that, was eating. 15 yards. I'm actually still sitting there.

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                    • C [email protected]

                      So fuck everyone who can't afford to, or doesn't want to, live in the city?

                      What the hell? Were did you pull that from my comment?

                      We need to work to improve public transport everywhere. Switzerland can have timely consistent trains to tiny villages in the fucking alps. We can have it here. We need to push for it though.

                      People saying "it doesn't work for me right now so shut up" are actively harmful to the discussion. They're choosing to be in a position where it doesn't work at all (though it doesn't work well for almost anyone in America outside of DC and NYC). I'm not saying "fuck them" I'm saying "your opinion is not relevant if it's only complaining about doing better because it's bad for you right now."

                      Its like saying we shouldn't go to the moon because it's hard right now, or we shouldn't try to develop nuclear fusion technology because it's hard right now. I don't care if it's hard right now. We're discussing what could/should be.

                      W This user is from outside of this forum
                      W This user is from outside of this forum
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                      wrote on last edited by
                      #191

                      Here's a summary of this thread:

                      Guy 1 - why is anyone doing waymo when there's public transit

                      Guy 2 - last mile problem

                      Guy 3 - it works great for me in the city surrounded by bus stops, no last mile problem

                      Me - it doesn't work great for me barely outside the city. (My point being that it'll take a lot to get public transit to within 1 mile of where I am, let alone to someone even further from the city)

                      You - you chose to live there so stop complaining

                      Me - so fuck me and everyone farther out than me apparently.

                      That's how we got here. I simply stated my situation as it relates to public transit, and you tell me it's just my own fault and I should shut up.

                      We have a long way to go to get ubiquitous public transit in America. I doubt we will ever get there. It makes sense to consider other options as well.

                      I'm saying we should go to the moon AND develop nuclear fusion.

                      You want to know what's harmful to discussion? Pricks like you telling people that their opinion is irrelevant.

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                      • W [email protected]

                        Here's a summary of this thread:

                        Guy 1 - why is anyone doing waymo when there's public transit

                        Guy 2 - last mile problem

                        Guy 3 - it works great for me in the city surrounded by bus stops, no last mile problem

                        Me - it doesn't work great for me barely outside the city. (My point being that it'll take a lot to get public transit to within 1 mile of where I am, let alone to someone even further from the city)

                        You - you chose to live there so stop complaining

                        Me - so fuck me and everyone farther out than me apparently.

                        That's how we got here. I simply stated my situation as it relates to public transit, and you tell me it's just my own fault and I should shut up.

                        We have a long way to go to get ubiquitous public transit in America. I doubt we will ever get there. It makes sense to consider other options as well.

                        I'm saying we should go to the moon AND develop nuclear fusion.

                        You want to know what's harmful to discussion? Pricks like you telling people that their opinion is irrelevant.

                        C This user is from outside of this forum
                        C This user is from outside of this forum
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                        wrote on last edited by
                        #192

                        I think you misunderstood most of what doesn't agree with you (purposefully or not).

                        Waymo is an investment.

                        So is public transport.

                        One is more effective and better for more people.

                        Why are we investing in Waymo?

                        You want to know what's harmful to discussion? Pricks like you telling people that their opinion is irrelevant.

                        Your opinion about right now is irrelevant to the discussion of how things should be. It is not irrelevant in a discussion about right now, only this one. Every time public transport is discussed someone like you feels the need to say "it doesn't work FOR ME (currently)!" OK... I'm not sure why we needed to know that. No one said it was great for everyone right now so you didn't add anything to the discussion. It only is a distraction from actually trying to fix things for you. Sometimes this is on purpose and sometimes it isn't. Either way, it's harmful not helpful.

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                        • C [email protected]

                          I think you misunderstood most of what doesn't agree with you (purposefully or not).

                          Waymo is an investment.

                          So is public transport.

                          One is more effective and better for more people.

                          Why are we investing in Waymo?

                          You want to know what's harmful to discussion? Pricks like you telling people that their opinion is irrelevant.

                          Your opinion about right now is irrelevant to the discussion of how things should be. It is not irrelevant in a discussion about right now, only this one. Every time public transport is discussed someone like you feels the need to say "it doesn't work FOR ME (currently)!" OK... I'm not sure why we needed to know that. No one said it was great for everyone right now so you didn't add anything to the discussion. It only is a distraction from actually trying to fix things for you. Sometimes this is on purpose and sometimes it isn't. Either way, it's harmful not helpful.

                          W This user is from outside of this forum
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                          wrote on last edited by
                          #193

                          Someone mentioned the last mile problem, and someone else responded as if it doesn't exist. I'm pointing out that it does exist.

                          That's all. Should we pretend like there's no problem?

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                          • kolanaki@pawb.socialK [email protected]

                            Let me clarify further: It was an attempt at humor, and not meant to be taken seriously as you are doing.

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                            wrote on last edited by
                            #194

                            Ah. Sorry. There are some truly braindead takes on autonomous vehicles so I couldn't tell that apart from what some people have said earnestly. My bad. 👍

                            kolanaki@pawb.socialK 1 Reply Last reply
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                            • T [email protected]

                              Because having a bus to pick up 7 people in a day is really efficient economically and environmentally...

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                              wrote on last edited by
                              #195

                              Much more so than having a car-centric infrastructure. If you start cherry-picking you'll of course find cases where a car would have been more efficient but public transportation needs to be understood as a whole.

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                              • J [email protected]

                                Ah. Sorry. There are some truly braindead takes on autonomous vehicles so I couldn't tell that apart from what some people have said earnestly. My bad. 👍

                                kolanaki@pawb.socialK This user is from outside of this forum
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                                wrote on last edited by
                                #196

                                I do think it would be much safer with zero human drivers and only autonomous vehicles on the road, for sure. But I also think it would be impractical to replace everything all at once. Even the best programmed thing would eventually encounter a human driver that defies all previously known data and freaks out the computer.

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                                • V [email protected]
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                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #197

                                  how those robot food delivery "robot ai boxes"? by starship doing?

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                                  • T [email protected]

                                    I completely disagree.

                                    For example, you are using the hand brake as an example. 95 percent of people (including you, evidently) don't even understand that the handbrake is not an emergency brake, they don't get how the behavior works, or the fact that it's meant to be used as a parking breaks, I consistently see people slam their parking pawls verytime they get out of their car. (Not to mention that it doesn't even work while you are driving on most modern cars and has no modulation, as it's just a button)

                                    If not being an idiot was good enough to drive a car, then it wouldn't be so deadly. It's also possible to fly a plane with common sense, but you wouldn't be happy if your pilot told you they don't have training.

                                    Driving isn't easy, it's just that we accept an absolutely catastrophic amount of accidents as a cost of doing business.

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                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #198

                                    It is an emergency brake when your brake fails, you donut

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                                    • kolanaki@pawb.socialK [email protected]

                                      I do think it would be much safer with zero human drivers and only autonomous vehicles on the road, for sure. But I also think it would be impractical to replace everything all at once. Even the best programmed thing would eventually encounter a human driver that defies all previously known data and freaks out the computer.

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                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #199

                                      I don't know anything about how autonomous vehicles work. As far as humans doing unusual things, well assuming the human driver only steers the wheel and controls the gas and breaks, it should be possible with existing technology to avoid crashing into them at least as well as any human can. So that leaves really unusual things, like the human hopping out of their car in the middle of an intersection, as the high-hanging fruit to model. I would imagine for most of these really strange cases, even if the autonomous vehicle can't understand what's happening, they can at least realize that something strange is happening and then pull over.

                                      Obviously there will be truly unusual situations that cause fatal collisions. So long as that is at a lower rate, then what's the safety concern?

                                      Safety is a red herring IMO, as better code can fix it. There are much worse potential problems that autonomous vehicles will cause than rare collisions. NotJustBikes has a lot of points I'd never considered before in the second half of this video. (The first half, though, I found aggravating; it's just about solvable safety risks.)

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                                      • G [email protected]

                                        Much more so than having a car-centric infrastructure. If you start cherry-picking you'll of course find cases where a car would have been more efficient but public transportation needs to be understood as a whole.

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                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #200

                                        I'm not cherry picking Im just telling you my personal experience and the town I live in

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                                        • Z [email protected]

                                          The way I edited the quote, it was just a like joke about braking vs breaking.

                                          Like I could make a pedantic reply about spelling, but no teslas in fact brake unexpectedly AND break unexpectedly. So, no notes!

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                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #201

                                          Ah OK didn't notice that. English is 2nd language.

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