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  3. 'An Insult To Life Itself': Hayao Miyazaki’s AI Criticism Resurfaces As OpenAI’s Ghibli-Style Image Trend Takes Over Social Media

'An Insult To Life Itself': Hayao Miyazaki’s AI Criticism Resurfaces As OpenAI’s Ghibli-Style Image Trend Takes Over Social Media

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  • underpantsweevil@lemmy.worldU [email protected]

    The bigger problem here is the loss of jobs and we are talking about a huge loss of employment that will affect economies really hard.

    I would say that's a tangential problem. Because, you know, in theory...

    But the deeper problem is ultimately in expertise as a learned skill developed over time and through practice. If you're de-skilling work, you're dismantling the tools by which we train the next generation of artists and production crews. If we were just replacing humans with machines for some route manual labor (like Pixar replaced Disney's old hand drawn animations with a newer CGI look), the result would be a new style and perhaps less tendentious from route reproductions.

    But we're gutting the whole process of development which means you're losing the pool of skilled professionals who know how to create CGI (or even flip-book style 60s animation) from first principles. That means sacrificing whole fields of specialized expertise for... what? This?

    N This user is from outside of this forum
    N This user is from outside of this forum
    [email protected]
    wrote on last edited by
    #99

    Reminds me of how millennials and generations onward have learned less and less maintainence skills to the point where most of us can't sow or fix shit if it's broken because we grew up in a consumer culture where you just buy a new one when the old one breaks. The quality of products have decreased too so they break quicker which gives people incentive to buy a new one instead of fixing.

    My parents generation hold on to old items and they patch up their clothes and know how to fix shit around the house but they didn't teach me any of that because the culture shifted and it wasn't really needed.

    We are not only losing skills and tactile learning and understanding, we are also rapidly torpedoing out planet into a massive trash heap. Which is a bit of a duh, I know, but still.

    underpantsweevil@lemmy.worldU 1 Reply Last reply
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    • P [email protected]

      Do you really not see the difference between food/shelter, things that you WILL die without, and employment?

      The only reason you need the latter for the former (and I mean, no you don't but whatever) is because of how society is set up.

      Your body doesn't shut down if you don't clock in to your job for X days.

      D This user is from outside of this forum
      D This user is from outside of this forum
      [email protected]
      wrote on last edited by
      #100

      I mean technically you are correct, but more in the "it's not the fall that kills me, but the landing" kind of way.

      My body doesn't shut down because I don't clock in, it shuts down because I don't have any food due to not clocking in.

      And yes, the only reason I need to work is because how our society's are set up. But guess what? I'm living in that society ^bottomtext^ so I can't exactly get away from it. Unless I have loads of, you guessed it, money.

      P 1 Reply Last reply
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      • natanox@discuss.tchncs.deN [email protected]

        These people from the Silicon Valley see themselves as the saviours of mankind (look up Longtermism in Silicon Valley). Within their structure of believe anything is within reason as long as it serves the greater good. That includes anything from obviously breaking the law to outright genocide, which we see in action right now.

        Of course since their moral code is already eroded to its core there are no boundaries, like "I shouldn't molest other people"…

        U This user is from outside of this forum
        U This user is from outside of this forum
        [email protected]
        wrote on last edited by
        #101

        But one of the biggest issue with these people is the total disconnect from actual normal life and communities. They see everything as computer program or tech device.

        Just like that millionaire trying to extend his life with thousand dollars worth of pills a month and daily schedules impossible to normal working people. When what research has shown is that people who live the longest have plant based diets and are active members of their communities.

        1 Reply Last reply
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        • M [email protected]

          My point makes sense. What doesn't make sense

          K This user is from outside of this forum
          K This user is from outside of this forum
          [email protected]
          wrote on last edited by
          #102

          "The best art is the one created by people who get no recognition for it"

          Do you also believe the best houses are built by people who have no training in how to build them?

          "Stop paying artists and people will keep creating"

          They will, they won't be able to spend the time required to become masters at it unless they're already rich enough not to have to spend time working. It's also the same thing here, let's stop paying plumbers, people who like doing plumbing will just continue doing it. Let's stop paying garbage people, someone will keep doing it because they like it... Oh wait, no they won't.

          https://newrepublic.com/article/159662/libertarian-walks-into-bear-book-review-free-town-project

          People deserve a form of compensation for their work if we want to live in functioning societies. If we go back to living in small tribes then sure, people will just do what they must without compensation because it's required to survive, but then human population would be in the millions instead of billions and we wouldn't be here to talk about it because the technology wouldn't exist anymore.

          M 1 Reply Last reply
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          • A [email protected]

            Altman doesn’t seemed to be concerned with consent in general.

            D This user is from outside of this forum
            D This user is from outside of this forum
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            wrote on last edited by
            #103

            Since when do rich billionaires care about consent??

            1 Reply Last reply
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            • D [email protected]

              I mean technically you are correct, but more in the "it's not the fall that kills me, but the landing" kind of way.

              My body doesn't shut down because I don't clock in, it shuts down because I don't have any food due to not clocking in.

              And yes, the only reason I need to work is because how our society's are set up. But guess what? I'm living in that society ^bottomtext^ so I can't exactly get away from it. Unless I have loads of, you guessed it, money.

              P This user is from outside of this forum
              P This user is from outside of this forum
              [email protected]
              wrote on last edited by
              #104

              Why do we have to go backwards? We're the most technologically advanced that we've ever been.

              Your brain has just been rotted by capitalism.

              D 1 Reply Last reply
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              • xthexder@l.sw0.comX [email protected]

                I'm not sure Sam Altman even knows what labor is.

                P This user is from outside of this forum
                P This user is from outside of this forum
                [email protected]
                wrote on last edited by
                #105

                Oh God I just thought that was some random "AI artist." It's so much more cringe now that you've brought my attention to who posted it.

                1 Reply Last reply
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                • K [email protected]

                  So was it trained on his work without his approval?

                  T This user is from outside of this forum
                  T This user is from outside of this forum
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                  wrote on last edited by
                  #106

                  Everything was. Is ...

                  1 Reply Last reply
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                  • D [email protected]

                    Like all other AI and all the copyright in the world. Shareholders are ok with. Copyright for me, not for you. Pirates were the bad guys. These are the saviours we deserve.

                    M This user is from outside of this forum
                    M This user is from outside of this forum
                    [email protected]
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #107

                    If you listen to the red hot chili peppers or watch a marvel movie or look at a DC comic and then go and make a song, movie, or painting inspired by the style of a certain creator that does not mean you have somehow violated those creators copyright. You don't owe them any money because you took inspiration.

                    AI training on publicly available data does not infringe on copyright even if that data is somehow copyrighted.

                    And I know that many people on these kinds of platforms don't like to hear this but the benefits of AI outweighs any potential legal issues copyright might entail.

                    Moreover, and I keep pointing this out over and over, you can't have the same information free for individuals to use and have it paid for at the same time for corporations. You have to decide if you want that information free for all or for none.

                    zoboomafoo@slrpnk.netZ 1 Reply Last reply
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                    • moe90@feddit.nlM [email protected]
                      This post did not contain any content.
                      M This user is from outside of this forum
                      M This user is from outside of this forum
                      [email protected]
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #108

                      Ya. These are the same people that continually try to take down Team Four Star for their satirization of DBZ because it made is actually better in many ways, from a country that has some of the worst satire and free use laws in the world.

                      Creators of copyrighted material in Japan can literally sue someone from making fun of their material.

                      Pardon me if I don't take their crocodile tears seriously.

                      J I 2 Replies Last reply
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                      • P [email protected]

                        Why do we have to go backwards? We're the most technologically advanced that we've ever been.

                        Your brain has just been rotted by capitalism.

                        D This user is from outside of this forum
                        D This user is from outside of this forum
                        [email protected]
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #109

                        Hah. you can be as "technologically advanced" as can be, if your society still lags behind significantly it doesn't matter.

                        It's not that my brain has been rotted by capitalism, it's that I absolutely have no faith that we will ever reach beyond tribe mentality.

                        1 Reply Last reply
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                        • S [email protected]

                          Next you're going to tell me using someones artstyle to depict someone getting deported is not appropriate for the white house twitter

                          nostradavid@programming.devN This user is from outside of this forum
                          nostradavid@programming.devN This user is from outside of this forum
                          [email protected]
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #110

                          While I agree that it's not appropriate, that woman was a drug dealer who returned illegally into the USA - I will shed no tear for her.

                          D J gloomy@mander.xyzG I S 6 Replies Last reply
                          0
                          • nostradavid@programming.devN [email protected]

                            While I agree that it's not appropriate, that woman was a drug dealer who returned illegally into the USA - I will shed no tear for her.

                            D This user is from outside of this forum
                            D This user is from outside of this forum
                            [email protected]
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #111

                            There'd be no need for drug dealers if drugs were decriminalized, like in other progressive Nations.

                            D dozzi92@lemmy.worldD nostradavid@programming.devN 3 Replies Last reply
                            0
                            • K [email protected]

                              Scale Lemmy to the size of Reddit and we'll see if good Samaritans are still willing to host it for free.

                              ayaya@lemdro.idA This user is from outside of this forum
                              ayaya@lemdro.idA This user is from outside of this forum
                              [email protected]
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #112

                              That's not really relevant to the discussion. The number of users doesn't matter. The point is that people will still create things even if there's no money in doing it.

                              Jellyfin is another example of something I use every day that is completely developed for free. The is no difference whether 100 people or 100 million people use it. It exists because the people who built it want it to exist.

                              K 1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • M [email protected]

                                If you listen to the red hot chili peppers or watch a marvel movie or look at a DC comic and then go and make a song, movie, or painting inspired by the style of a certain creator that does not mean you have somehow violated those creators copyright. You don't owe them any money because you took inspiration.

                                AI training on publicly available data does not infringe on copyright even if that data is somehow copyrighted.

                                And I know that many people on these kinds of platforms don't like to hear this but the benefits of AI outweighs any potential legal issues copyright might entail.

                                Moreover, and I keep pointing this out over and over, you can't have the same information free for individuals to use and have it paid for at the same time for corporations. You have to decide if you want that information free for all or for none.

                                zoboomafoo@slrpnk.netZ This user is from outside of this forum
                                zoboomafoo@slrpnk.netZ This user is from outside of this forum
                                [email protected]
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #113

                                Who's watching marvel movies for free, legally? Who's listening to RHCP's entire discography for free, legally?

                                Not the people training AI, they've been caught pirating their data multiple times.

                                M 1 Reply Last reply
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                                • nostradavid@programming.devN [email protected]

                                  While I agree that it's not appropriate, that woman was a drug dealer who returned illegally into the USA - I will shed no tear for her.

                                  J This user is from outside of this forum
                                  J This user is from outside of this forum
                                  [email protected]
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #114

                                  She's a human being that deserves a fair trial.

                                  1 Reply Last reply
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                                  • E [email protected]

                                    It must be nice to go through the world and be so sure something so utterly stupid. Who cares about reality, I have FEELINGS.

                                    Seriously no you've completely failed to listen to literally anything that I said. Give me an example of a novel that was Self-Published that is better than anything that was commercially available.

                                    By definition anything that's good enough to make money makes money.

                                    M This user is from outside of this forum
                                    M This user is from outside of this forum
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                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #115

                                    Give me anything published that actually matters in your day to day life. Give me any piece of created work that if it didn't exist, you just couldn't function.

                                    What is your judgement of what is better or not. I'm trying you that in my life the stuff I've seen the random person create on their own often surpasses the person trying to pursue a career

                                    1 Reply Last reply
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                                    • D [email protected]

                                      There'd be no need for drug dealers if drugs were decriminalized, like in other progressive Nations.

                                      D This user is from outside of this forum
                                      D This user is from outside of this forum
                                      [email protected]
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #116

                                      Lol forgot they call weed drug

                                      A 1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • N [email protected]

                                        Reminds me of how millennials and generations onward have learned less and less maintainence skills to the point where most of us can't sow or fix shit if it's broken because we grew up in a consumer culture where you just buy a new one when the old one breaks. The quality of products have decreased too so they break quicker which gives people incentive to buy a new one instead of fixing.

                                        My parents generation hold on to old items and they patch up their clothes and know how to fix shit around the house but they didn't teach me any of that because the culture shifted and it wasn't really needed.

                                        We are not only losing skills and tactile learning and understanding, we are also rapidly torpedoing out planet into a massive trash heap. Which is a bit of a duh, I know, but still.

                                        underpantsweevil@lemmy.worldU This user is from outside of this forum
                                        underpantsweevil@lemmy.worldU This user is from outside of this forum
                                        [email protected]
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #117

                                        millennials and generations onward have learned less and less maintainence skills to the point where most of us can’t sow or fix shit if it’s broken because we grew up in a consumer culture where you just buy a new one when the old one breaks

                                        Planned Obselecence means a lot of modern consumer goods are deliberately designed to be difficult to repair.

                                        More cheap plastic used for buckles and clasps. More glue used in place of screws or latches. More electronics soddered or otherwise made irreplaceable/inaccessible to an amateur. Shoes, in particular, leap to mind. Shoe repair used to be a standard dry cleaning service. It's practically extinct today. Very few good ways to repair a modem sneaker.

                                        My parents generation hold on to old items and they patch up their clothes and know how to fix shit around the house but they didn’t teach me any of that because the culture shifted and it wasn’t really needed.

                                        There's a time cost to repair and maintenance that's often frustrating. I don't blame folks for opting towards convenience. But I feel horrible every time I take out the trash, knowing how much plastic waste I accrue every month.

                                        1 Reply Last reply
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                                        • K [email protected]

                                          "The best art is the one created by people who get no recognition for it"

                                          Do you also believe the best houses are built by people who have no training in how to build them?

                                          "Stop paying artists and people will keep creating"

                                          They will, they won't be able to spend the time required to become masters at it unless they're already rich enough not to have to spend time working. It's also the same thing here, let's stop paying plumbers, people who like doing plumbing will just continue doing it. Let's stop paying garbage people, someone will keep doing it because they like it... Oh wait, no they won't.

                                          https://newrepublic.com/article/159662/libertarian-walks-into-bear-book-review-free-town-project

                                          People deserve a form of compensation for their work if we want to live in functioning societies. If we go back to living in small tribes then sure, people will just do what they must without compensation because it's required to survive, but then human population would be in the millions instead of billions and we wouldn't be here to talk about it because the technology wouldn't exist anymore.

                                          M This user is from outside of this forum
                                          M This user is from outside of this forum
                                          [email protected]
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #118

                                          They are compensated. But they didn't be compensated if their work is used to train AI.

                                          K 1 Reply Last reply
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