German army struggles to get Gen Z recruits ‘ready for war’
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As a German Gen Z my main concern would be the fact that you can't rely on the promise that our army is purely there for defence. I'm ready to defend my home and the home of my neighbors but I'm not willing to be sent to another continent to do so. Right now that may not be an issue but these things can change overnight.
What do you mean? Germany is defended in the Hindukush of course /s
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What do you mean? Germany is defended in the Hindukush of course /s
Exactly
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But one senior army commander said members of Generation Z — renowned in the business world for their efforts to reshape corporate culture — were also going into the armed forces with different ideas and outlooks. “People are vulnerable, they cry easily,” he said. “They talk about work-life balance.”
“I understand that,” the commander added. “They grew up in a different time. It’s not a bad perspective. But it doesn’t match that well with a wartime situation.”
Work-life balance obviously goes out the window in a war (actually, life itself does). Does being vulnerable really preclude you from being brave, though?
We live in a hyper-individualistic society which is self-centred. This is only exacerbated by social media, where attention and being the main character is more important than ever.
The new generation is living more and more in society. Instead of being part of society. Being part of something bigger is uncommon nowadays. Which makes participation in something as extreme as a war unfathomable.
If you look at countries with high levels of civil sense like Taiwan. We see school uniforms and military service. Kids are being raised to be part of a free and democratic society, not to just live in it. -
It was true. It was the longest continuous peace in Europe ever.
Yeah, but, they all end. Nobody ever had a good argument why it had to go on forever.
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Yeah that's why current events hit people twice as hard. We basically all assumed peace to be a given. It's not.
I wish the West could have woken up before it was on top of us.
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Technically, conventional war is largely obsolete. As long as you do have a reliable and credible nuclear deterrent. Germany has long been in the very comfortable position to fool itself into deeming conventional war obsolete without having to maintain an own nuclear deterrent. With the USA finally having revealed itself as an utterly unreliable ally, (as more of the kind of "ally" commonly called an enemy) this illusion is falling apart.
Oh, well that's true. How is the offer of formal protection by France being received? I'd hate to see more proliferation.
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We live in a hyper-individualistic society which is self-centred. This is only exacerbated by social media, where attention and being the main character is more important than ever.
The new generation is living more and more in society. Instead of being part of society. Being part of something bigger is uncommon nowadays. Which makes participation in something as extreme as a war unfathomable.
If you look at countries with high levels of civil sense like Taiwan. We see school uniforms and military service. Kids are being raised to be part of a free and democratic society, not to just live in it.I can't really provide evidence for or against that in recent years, but I'll point out the greatest generation grew up during the literal great depression, with starvation and (in America) the KKK running around.
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I wish the West could have woken up before it was on top of us.
Better late than never
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It’s an amassment of stupid people who can’t make it in the private sector. No one with a quarter of a brain can stand being in that organisation.
Sounds a bit like the German military. Does Swiss German also know the term "Zivilversager"?
Ziviluntauglich. Wer nicht Militärdienstfähig ist wird bei uns als "untauglich" klassifiziert, daher der Begriff.
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I’m a millennial who was happy to not be required to go through military training back when it was still a thing but already phasing out. Bundeswehr was a thing for gun fanatics and manly men, nothing that was actually necessary. I was a pacifist. My work values today are now close to what Gen Z apparently has. Work is simply not the center of my life anymore.
These days I’m wondering if a 40 year old man (in better shape than my 18 year old self though) can still enlist voluntarily because I want to fight for our European values. I’d rather die in battle than being occupied by power hungry dictators.
This article I read some hours ago is relevant.
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Better late than never
Absolutely.
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This article I read some hours ago is relevant.
Very interesting, thank you!
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You're absolutely not too old to join the Bundeswehr. Depending on your life situation you could opt to do a FWD (voluntary military service) for at least 7 months or be trained as untrained civilian in the "Ungedient" programme in distinct blocks to not impact your day to day life so much. I would advise to contact your local recruitment office and talk to them, you can get their guidance on your individual situation without signing any commitments.
Thanks for the info!
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cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/27232360
Perhaps it's the military that is outdated.
I've been thinking about that several decades ago, watching my friends come back from the military training with completely useless skills regardless of their ranks. The "war time" skillset and communication are based on ideals from the 1950s. It's been allowed to exist as a separate culture inside the military only because the authorities inside the military keeps repeating the same ideas through generations.
There's no doubt that military work does require a very efficient and brutally direct communication, but the top down chain of command and hierachy often fails to take advantage of more modern skills where communication happens more efficiently across networks instead of tree-shaped structures, and where every node is important, not just as a link in a chain.
Businesses have had many of the same experiences with generation Z. They don't want to play the role of the pawn in chess and would rather walk away than take orders blindly. I don't blame them, but it's obviously a bad starting point for army recruitment. The military will have to come up with something new to address the issue.
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cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/27232360
Fuck war! No one should be in the military, those who cause wars should go and fight them instead of sending others.
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I am Swiss. Let me tell you, our army is a joke. The system is there but it's only on paper.
At least your Air Force will fly at night now...
https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/politics/swiss-air-force-finally-on-call-around-the-clock/46253116
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Fuck war! No one should be in the military, those who cause wars should go and fight them instead of sending others.
Sure, but unless you can get Putin to come out, someone has to kill several thousand Russians each week
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Don't need to tell me but one thing is visible and tangible everyday and the other thing is something way more abstract for most.
Bucha isn't abstract.
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Perhaps it's the military that is outdated.
I've been thinking about that several decades ago, watching my friends come back from the military training with completely useless skills regardless of their ranks. The "war time" skillset and communication are based on ideals from the 1950s. It's been allowed to exist as a separate culture inside the military only because the authorities inside the military keeps repeating the same ideas through generations.
There's no doubt that military work does require a very efficient and brutally direct communication, but the top down chain of command and hierachy often fails to take advantage of more modern skills where communication happens more efficiently across networks instead of tree-shaped structures, and where every node is important, not just as a link in a chain.
Businesses have had many of the same experiences with generation Z. They don't want to play the role of the pawn in chess and would rather walk away than take orders blindly. I don't blame them, but it's obviously a bad starting point for army recruitment. The military will have to come up with something new to address the issue.
Our time is one where traditional ways aren't worth it, or in many cases even possible
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As human civilisation, we all lost honor, accountability, pride of a well done job.
Decades of neoliberalism glorifying boundless egotism as the ultimate freedom and elevating limitless consumption to the highest achievement made sure of it.
I think we also lack small communities.
Definitely. Unfortunately, neoliberalism with all its deregulation has also been systematically destroying the small scale economy that has kept small communities alive. Working class people can't afford services of local small businesses anymore, and have to look for work further and further away from their homes. In rural areas hit especially hard by this (politically wanted) structural change, this has already lead to a massive depopulation, leaving behind only the destitute who can barely afford a sense of community, and a handful of wealthy people who enjoy owning a cheap weekend home on the countryside just as much as they love to shit on the community it is located in.
There's no pride in today's workplace. It's underpaid demeaning work where hard work gets you nowhere
