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  3. Trump has blown up the world order - and left Europe's leaders scrabbling

Trump has blown up the world order - and left Europe's leaders scrabbling

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  • mrsjmccrimmon@feddit.ukM This user is from outside of this forum
    mrsjmccrimmon@feddit.ukM This user is from outside of this forum
    [email protected]
    wrote on last edited by
    #1

    “Donald Trump is the first US President since World War Two to challenge the role that his country set for itself many decades ago. And he is doing this in such a way that, to many, the old world order appears to be over - and the new world order has yet to take shape.

    The question is, which nations will step forward? And, with the security of Europe under greater strain than at any time almost in living memory, can its leaders, who are currently scrabbling around, find an adequate response?”

    extremedullard@lemmy.sdf.orgE S dan1101@lemm.eeD ? 4 Replies Last reply
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    • mrsjmccrimmon@feddit.ukM [email protected]

      “Donald Trump is the first US President since World War Two to challenge the role that his country set for itself many decades ago. And he is doing this in such a way that, to many, the old world order appears to be over - and the new world order has yet to take shape.

      The question is, which nations will step forward? And, with the security of Europe under greater strain than at any time almost in living memory, can its leaders, who are currently scrabbling around, find an adequate response?”

      extremedullard@lemmy.sdf.orgE This user is from outside of this forum
      extremedullard@lemmy.sdf.orgE This user is from outside of this forum
      [email protected]
      wrote on last edited by
      #2

      Trump may have shot the US in the foot on that one: I have a feeling Europe will finally do what they should have done decades ago - i.e. ween itself off the US' protection, and also off US tech, with France taking the lead on the military effort at least - and this may hasten the US' slide into irrelevance.

      U G 2 Replies Last reply
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      • mrsjmccrimmon@feddit.ukM [email protected]

        “Donald Trump is the first US President since World War Two to challenge the role that his country set for itself many decades ago. And he is doing this in such a way that, to many, the old world order appears to be over - and the new world order has yet to take shape.

        The question is, which nations will step forward? And, with the security of Europe under greater strain than at any time almost in living memory, can its leaders, who are currently scrabbling around, find an adequate response?”

        S This user is from outside of this forum
        S This user is from outside of this forum
        [email protected]
        wrote on last edited by
        #3

        Hopefully they find a bingo, the world sure needs it.

        O 1 Reply Last reply
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        • extremedullard@lemmy.sdf.orgE [email protected]

          Trump may have shot the US in the foot on that one: I have a feeling Europe will finally do what they should have done decades ago - i.e. ween itself off the US' protection, and also off US tech, with France taking the lead on the military effort at least - and this may hasten the US' slide into irrelevance.

          U This user is from outside of this forum
          U This user is from outside of this forum
          [email protected]
          wrote on last edited by
          #4

          Hopefully. If most European countries haven't themselves succumbed to elected Putin-funded fascist regimes before that happens.

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          • extremedullard@lemmy.sdf.orgE [email protected]

            Trump may have shot the US in the foot on that one: I have a feeling Europe will finally do what they should have done decades ago - i.e. ween itself off the US' protection, and also off US tech, with France taking the lead on the military effort at least - and this may hasten the US' slide into irrelevance.

            G This user is from outside of this forum
            G This user is from outside of this forum
            [email protected]
            wrote on last edited by
            #5

            I think, long term, we’re going to see leadership coming from France (naval, air), Poland (ground), Sweden (also naval and air), and the Baltic states (intelligence/cyberwarfare). I hope Germany ends up contributing meaningfully, but I’m honestly not sure they’ll get out of the way of their own bureaucracy. I know they are doing a huge defense spending increase, but I also recall the last time they did that in 2022 and how it somewhat flamed out as a result of said bureaucracy (not to mention the fact that they refused to lift a finger until the US started doing something first).

            S 1 Reply Last reply
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            • mrsjmccrimmon@feddit.ukM [email protected]

              “Donald Trump is the first US President since World War Two to challenge the role that his country set for itself many decades ago. And he is doing this in such a way that, to many, the old world order appears to be over - and the new world order has yet to take shape.

              The question is, which nations will step forward? And, with the security of Europe under greater strain than at any time almost in living memory, can its leaders, who are currently scrabbling around, find an adequate response?”

              dan1101@lemm.eeD This user is from outside of this forum
              dan1101@lemm.eeD This user is from outside of this forum
              [email protected]
              wrote on last edited by
              #6

              Best case hopefully countries become stronger and better prepared for one rogue state after this.

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              • S [email protected]

                Hopefully they find a bingo, the world sure needs it.

                O This user is from outside of this forum
                O This user is from outside of this forum
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                wrote on last edited by
                #7

                Parcheesi for the triple word score on the checkmate.

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                • mrsjmccrimmon@feddit.ukM [email protected]

                  “Donald Trump is the first US President since World War Two to challenge the role that his country set for itself many decades ago. And he is doing this in such a way that, to many, the old world order appears to be over - and the new world order has yet to take shape.

                  The question is, which nations will step forward? And, with the security of Europe under greater strain than at any time almost in living memory, can its leaders, who are currently scrabbling around, find an adequate response?”

                  ? Offline
                  ? Offline
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                  wrote on last edited by
                  #8

                  Donald Trump is the first US President since World War Two to challenge the role that his country set for itself many decades ago.

                  Keywords here are "set for itself", despite what Americans like to say about other countries depending on their leadership.

                  They conveniently ignore that at the time the US voluntarily took that role Europe was completely torn apart and destroyed, while the US had the luxury of sitting out most of the war with that 'big, beautiful ocean' apart Trump is so proud of. And no neighbors posing any kind of threat. They helped indirectly at first, sure, but only really jumped in at the end, after the war had made it to US shores through Pearl Harbor.

                  Let's not pretend the US hasn't benefitted massively from its prestigious position, setting its currency as the world trade currency, NATO article 5 post 9/11, lack of proper taxation by Europe on US digital products and services we consume, and the list goes on and on.

                  The US is absolutely and objectively not a poor victim here. As much as they like to pretend it.

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                  • G [email protected]

                    I think, long term, we’re going to see leadership coming from France (naval, air), Poland (ground), Sweden (also naval and air), and the Baltic states (intelligence/cyberwarfare). I hope Germany ends up contributing meaningfully, but I’m honestly not sure they’ll get out of the way of their own bureaucracy. I know they are doing a huge defense spending increase, but I also recall the last time they did that in 2022 and how it somewhat flamed out as a result of said bureaucracy (not to mention the fact that they refused to lift a finger until the US started doing something first).

                    S This user is from outside of this forum
                    S This user is from outside of this forum
                    [email protected]
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #9

                    Germany is one of the greatest liabilities to the EU right now. The dawning government coalition is set to massively increase authoritarian surveillance, pander to far right and fascist extremists, block energy and transport transition and the establishment of a modern industrial base. Meanwhile Germany dismantles the somewhat rules based order it used to help build by its unhinged support for Israel, while Israel and Russia are pocketing the European far right. Finally by deliberately ignoring social issues the current and upcoming German government are actively working to make the fascist AfD the strongest party in the next election.

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