Russia preparing for confrontation with Europe, EU's von der Leyen says
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Ukraine had a stronger military compared to Germany, France, Italy, and the United Kingdom combined.
Ukraine had a thousand tanks at the start of the war. At least half of them were modernized. The T-64BV Model 2017 has third generation thermal, new gun stabilizer, new autoloader, same fire suppression system as T-84 Oplot-M, digital communications, satellite navigation, and other improvements. They also upgraded their T-80s to T-80BV Model 2018 which brings it up to T-64BV Model 2017 standard. There is also T-64BM and T-64BM2 which are similar to the T-64BV Model 2017 but with a more modern fire control system. These tanks are not really much worst than say a Leopard 2.
Germany, France, Italy, and the United Kingdom have less than a thousand tanks combined.
Ukraine had two thousand MT-LBs which are fairly decent APCs (Russia had 3,000). They also had hundreds of modern BTR-4s and BTR-3s supplemented by hundreds of BTR-70s and BTR-80s.
Ukraine had far more artillery guns compared to these countries combined. This includes the 500 2S3s they had at the start of the war which is Soviet counterpart to M109. They also had plenty of 2S1s and 2S19s. Even if you include only the 2S3s (which again are comparable to the M109), this is roughly the same amount of M109s that the US has.
Ukraine has almost five times the amount of multiple launch rocket systems as France, Germany, Italy, and the UK combined. They are also the largest user of HIMARS and M270 outside of the US with them having more than France and Germany combined.
Ukraine has also received over a hundred modern tanks (roughly the same amount the UK has) and over half a thousand of modern artillery guns from the West which is more artillery guns than the amount that France, German, Italy, and the UK have combined. This has helped replace their losses with their fleet of 2S3s which for example dwindled down to 140.
Ukrainian military was also being trained by NATO since 2015 and also received MILES gear.
The UK practically sent their entire stockpile of SPGs to Ukraine and begged to Sweden to replace their fleet and Poland thrown half of their stockpile of SPGs to Ukraine. Almost every European country has complained about massive shortages of ammunition due to it all being given to Ukraine. France stated they could only fight Russia for a few weeks before running out of ammo.
Ukraine literally has a stronger military than France, Germany, Italy, and the UK combined. There is a reason why these countries state a Ukrainian defeat would be the end of Europe although in my opinion Russia has no plans to invade more countries outside of maybe the Baltics.
All of this despite most of the Russian Armed Forces not even being in Ukraine, majority of forces in Ukraine again are from irregular volunteer formations recruited from regions across Russia.
Perhaps do not just compare the number of military personnel. Obviously the number would go up 10x for those counties too during war. Just like it did in Ukraine.
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Well there is a lot of preparation for something going on.
Russia has been massively expanding its military to the point that they are modernizing T-62s with thermals to give to regular units. This is not because of losses in Ukraine. T-90M losses in Ukraine are low as per Oryx with Russia replacing three years of T-90M losses in 2-3 months in 2024. Russia produced 20-30 T-90Ms per month in 2024 which is 240 to 360 in a year (more tanks than the amount Germany has in its entire military). This likely has doubled or even quadrupled since then.
People severely underestimate the size of Uralvagonzavod. It is the largest tank factory in the world. Here it is superimposed over Washington DC and US tank factories:
Russia had 2.650 T-72B3s and T-72BAs in active service at the start of the war. They have only lost 790 since the start of the war as per Oryx. This leaves them with almost 2,000 T-72B3s and T-72BAs. This combined with old T-72Bs being modernized since the start of the war means Russia likely has well over 2,000 T-72s in active service.
This is already more tanks than the amount the US has in active service (around 1,600, Wikipedia states 2,600 but this is incorrect as the amount of Armoured BCTs got decreased).
Russia had around 300 T-90Ms at the start of 2024. Accounting for losses, they had 500-620 at the end of the year. By the end of this year, they will have 700-920 assuming losses and production stays the same.
Around a thousand T-62s have left storage since the start of the war. Most have been modernized.
This means Russia will have almost 4,000 tanks by the end of this year assuming production of T-90Ms did not increase since 2024 which I doubt.
The T-90M and T-72B3 are comparable to western tanks. The modernized T-62s are nowhere near as good as western tanks but will still be a major threat due to their large numbers.
We also know Russia is massively expanding its army because they have been establishing new units.
Here is just one example, the 44th Army Corps:
Which even western sources noted.
This is a newly formed Army Corps.
Russia even formed a new Motor Rifle Regiment just a week ago:
People forget that most of the Russian Armed Forces is not taking part in the Special Military Operation. The majority of soldiers in Ukraine are from irregular volunteer formations not from regular Russian military units. This is well shown by the losses.
Motorized Rifles: 6,457
VDV: 3,257
Naval Infantry: 1,305
Tank Crew: 1,806
Artillery: 851
Special Forces: 736
Engineering: 291
Navy: 291
VVS: 265
Other: 957
Total: 16,216
Source: MediaZona
This shows that the losses of Russian regulars is actually quite low. Including irregulars, the losses would be almost one hundred thousand as per the same source. This shows that Russia is mostly using irregulars.
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I would never underestimate Ukraine. Slava Ukraini!!!
Than you know your comment is nonesense. Ukraine has a stronger military than Germany, France, Italy, and the UK combined. This was the case even at the start of the war. Most of the Russian Armed Forces are not even deployed to Ukraine.
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Perhaps do not just compare the number of military personnel. Obviously the number would go up 10x for those counties too during war. Just like it did in Ukraine.
It is not just military personnel. Read the links.
It seems like a Russian psyop (not that you are part of one) everytime someone underestimates Russia. It just seems like people want to make Russia seems weak so Europe does not rearm. Underestimating Russia only benefits Russia. Also see my new comment.
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Than you know your comment is nonesense. Ukraine has a stronger military than Germany, France, Italy, and the UK combined. This was the case even at the start of the war. Most of the Russian Armed Forces are not even deployed to Ukraine.
Yes, but the EU countries have much more modern weapons.
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Yes, but the EU countries have much more modern weapons.
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Air superiority is the big one.
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Air superiority is the big one.
In the age of modern SAMs?
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In the age of modern SAMs?
Russia wants to keep a rainy day fund in the event of Western intervention.
That's what the nukes are for. The ones that still work, anyway.
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Russia wants to keep a rainy day fund in the event of Western intervention.
That's what the nukes are for. The ones that still work, anyway.
See? This is what I mean. You are underestimating Russia which only benefits Russia. Nuclear weapons are maintained and tested regularly. Russia's nuclear forces are constantly doing military exercises to ensure readiness.
Like why do people keep underestimating the Russian military? Do they want the EU to not rearm? That only benefits Russia.
Western airpower will not do anything. Even if they don't follow the Princess Diana accords, they will struggle to penetrate Russian air defences. The main reason why the Russian Air Force has not been able to achieve air superiority is because Ukraine has more S-300s than the amount of AA batteries western Europe has combined.
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Kinda weird anyone's worried I've seen sims of eurofighters vs Su-57 felons and the eurofighters beat Russias newest stealth fighter with even numbers.
Russias a pure non threat right now militarily all they can really do is threaten Nukes and if they did it's over for them.
I'd say Both Russia and the US are in major decline right now and we should just give Ukraine enough support to keep embarrassing them. Not sure Im for invading Russia directly unless they attack a Nato member.
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Kinda weird anyone's worried I've seen sims of eurofighters vs Su-57 felons and the eurofighters beat Russias newest stealth fighter with even numbers.
Russias a pure non threat right now militarily all they can really do is threaten Nukes and if they did it's over for them.
I'd say Both Russia and the US are in major decline right now and we should just give Ukraine enough support to keep embarrassing them. Not sure Im for invading Russia directly unless they attack a Nato member.
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Simulations using what data?
Stop underestimating Russia. It only benefits Russia. Do you want the EU to not rearm giving Russia the advantage?
Simulations like Dcs using all known data also they only have about 6 of those planes anyways. Russian equipment is a joke they are using donkeys in Ukraine ffs.
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Simulations like Dcs using all known data also they only have about 6 of those planes anyways. Russian equipment is a joke they are using donkeys in Ukraine ffs.
Su-57 is not in DCS. Not without modding done by random people on the internet. LOL.
Lets look at actual data.
The Su-57 is the only fighter jet in service that has DIRCM. This provides it with protection against IR-guided missiles. These would be the main threat to the Su-57. This is because the Su-57 has a very low RCS meaning radar-guided missiles would have a hard time targetting it.
We know the Su-57 has a very low RCS thanks to radar scattering simulations. It is slightly less stealthy compared to an F-35 but still far more stealthier compared to 4th generation aircraft like the Eurofighter Typhoon. An F-35 would only be capable of seeing the Su-57 on its radar 30 miles away. The Su-57 would actually be able to spot the F-35 sooner due to its L-band radar which the F-35 lacks. RAM has no effect against L-band radar. The L-band radar can provide the rough location of the F-35 allowing the Su-57's X-band radar to use that rough location to guide a concentrated set of beams towards the area to accurately detect the target and guide a missile against it. People like to bring up the Patent but the Patent explicity stated the RCS did not account for RAM.
People like to bring up the lack of an S-duct. The Su-57 solves this problem with the use of a radar blocker.
The Su-57 also has the deepest internal weapons bays out of any fifth generation aircraft. It can carry four air-launched cruise missiles (specifically the Kh-69 and Kh-59MK2).
Su-57 as stated earlier also has L-band radar unlike other fifth generation aircraft which means its radar-guided missiles are actually a threat to stealth aircraft unlike the F-35's radar-guided missiles.
This is not to say the Su-57 can ace the entire F-35 fleet. The F-35 was made that way on purpose. It is a single-engined aircraft (meaning less capable but cheaper) allowing Western countries to have a shit load of them. The Su-57 is more akin to the F-22. A twin engined high perfromance but expensive aircraft. Despite this, Russia is actually not that outnumbered in terms of fifth generation aircraft if you do not include the US. Including the US, the West has over a thousand of them compared to the mere dozens Russia has.
Russia also has more than 6. Production peaked at 12 per year with Russia having 21 serial produced aircraft. Russia did open another production facility which will double production to 24 per year.
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Kinda weird anyone's worried I've seen sims of eurofighters vs Su-57 felons and the eurofighters beat Russias newest stealth fighter with even numbers.
Russias a pure non threat right now militarily all they can really do is threaten Nukes and if they did it's over for them.
I'd say Both Russia and the US are in major decline right now and we should just give Ukraine enough support to keep embarrassing them. Not sure Im for invading Russia directly unless they attack a Nato member.
Not sure Im for invading Russia directly unless they attack a Nato member.
I'm pretty sure that's exactly the attitude Russia is counting on. Personally I think it's time we start treating propaganda and disinformation aimed at destabilizing other countries as literal acts of war on par with physical attacks.
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Su-57 is not in DCS. Not without modding done by random people on the internet. LOL.
Lets look at actual data.
The Su-57 is the only fighter jet in service that has DIRCM. This provides it with protection against IR-guided missiles. These would be the main threat to the Su-57. This is because the Su-57 has a very low RCS meaning radar-guided missiles would have a hard time targetting it.
We know the Su-57 has a very low RCS thanks to radar scattering simulations. It is slightly less stealthy compared to an F-35 but still far more stealthier compared to 4th generation aircraft like the Eurofighter Typhoon. An F-35 would only be capable of seeing the Su-57 on its radar 30 miles away. The Su-57 would actually be able to spot the F-35 sooner due to its L-band radar which the F-35 lacks. RAM has no effect against L-band radar. The L-band radar can provide the rough location of the F-35 allowing the Su-57's X-band radar to use that rough location to guide a concentrated set of beams towards the area to accurately detect the target and guide a missile against it. People like to bring up the Patent but the Patent explicity stated the RCS did not account for RAM.
People like to bring up the lack of an S-duct. The Su-57 solves this problem with the use of a radar blocker.
The Su-57 also has the deepest internal weapons bays out of any fifth generation aircraft. It can carry four air-launched cruise missiles (specifically the Kh-69 and Kh-59MK2).
Su-57 as stated earlier also has L-band radar unlike other fifth generation aircraft which means its radar-guided missiles are actually a threat to stealth aircraft unlike the F-35's radar-guided missiles.
This is not to say the Su-57 can ace the entire F-35 fleet. The F-35 was made that way on purpose. It is a single-engined aircraft (meaning less capable but cheaper) allowing Western countries to have a shit load of them. The Su-57 is more akin to the F-22. A twin engined high perfromance but expensive aircraft. Despite this, Russia is actually not that outnumbered in terms of fifth generation aircraft if you do not include the US. Including the US, the West has over a thousand of them compared to the mere dozens Russia has.
Russia also has more than 6. Production peaked at 12 per year with Russia having 21 serial produced aircraft. Russia did open another production facility which will double production to 24 per year.
The Felon was bad enough they couldn't sell it full stop and production is already over at a handful of units. Yes the rcs was estimated but it still lost those sims despite having a much lower rcs than the Typhoon.
Point is it's probably the worst stealth plane in the world against a fighter like an f-35 or even a Chinese J-20 it wouldn't even launch a missile.
All Russian hyped tech has proven to be very bad when actually used is the point they claim to be a superpower but they aren't and never will be again.
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The Felon was bad enough they couldn't sell it full stop and production is already over at a handful of units. Yes the rcs was estimated but it still lost those sims despite having a much lower rcs than the Typhoon.
Point is it's probably the worst stealth plane in the world against a fighter like an f-35 or even a Chinese J-20 it wouldn't even launch a missile.
All Russian hyped tech has proven to be very bad when actually used is the point they claim to be a superpower but they aren't and never will be again.
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Your simulations are literally random mods for DCS. Your argument is already invalid.
Production is not over. Russia plans to produce Su-57Ms this year. Su-57M upgrades the Su-57 with sixth generation technology including AI and drone integration.
By the time Russia makes any meaningful numbers the rest of us will be in Tempests, FCAS and NGAD. I'd be Suprised if they can make any more actually given it's 14 years old anyway and most people class it as 4.5 gen.
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By the time Russia makes any meaningful numbers the rest of us will be in Tempests, FCAS and NGAD. I'd be Suprised if they can make any more actually given it's 14 years old anyway and most people class it as 4.5 gen.
By the time Russia makes any meaningful numbers the rest of us will be in Tempests, FCAS and NGAD.
Why should Russia produce its own NGAD when Su-57M already integrates 6th generation technology including AI and drones to the Su-57?
The F-47 is smaller than Su-57M and is also smaller than China’s J-36. NGAD just seems like corruption to keep Boeing afloat. Boeing was not even expected to be the winning contender for the contract. That would be Lockheed Martin.
Both the J-36 and Su-57M would be better contenders for sixth generation aircraft.
I’d be Suprised if they can make any more actually given it’s 14 years old anyway
What? You don’t make sense. Su-57 entered production in 2021 and production peaked in 2023 with 12 being produced. Russia started retooling the production facilities for Su-57M production in 2024 which is the reason why only 6 were produced in 2024. Russia constructed a new production facility made entirely for Su-57M production. This means production should at least double to 24 per year. Although it will probably more than double to maybe 36 or more per year as the Su-57s had to share the assembly line with Su-35s in the first production facility.
most people class it as 4.5 gen.
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Well there is a lot of preparation for something going on.
Russia has been massively expanding its military to the point that they are modernizing T-62s with thermals to give to regular units. This is not because of losses in Ukraine. T-90M losses in Ukraine are low as per Oryx with Russia replacing three years of T-90M losses in 2-3 months in 2024. Russia produced 20-30 T-90Ms per month in 2024 which is 240 to 360 in a year (more tanks than the amount Germany has in its entire military). This likely has doubled or even quadrupled since then.
People severely underestimate the size of Uralvagonzavod. It is the largest tank factory in the world. Here it is superimposed over Washington DC and US tank factories:
Russia had 2.650 T-72B3s and T-72BAs in active service at the start of the war. They have only lost 790 since the start of the war as per Oryx. This leaves them with almost 2,000 T-72B3s and T-72BAs. This combined with old T-72Bs being modernized since the start of the war means Russia likely has well over 2,000 T-72s in active service.
This is already more tanks than the amount the US has in active service (around 1,600, Wikipedia states 2,600 but this is incorrect as the amount of Armoured BCTs got decreased).
Russia had around 300 T-90Ms at the start of 2024. Accounting for losses, they had 500-620 at the end of the year. By the end of this year, they will have 700-920 assuming losses and production stays the same.
Around a thousand T-62s have left storage since the start of the war. Most have been modernized.
This means Russia will have almost 4,000 tanks by the end of this year assuming production of T-90Ms did not increase since 2024 which I doubt.
The T-90M and T-72B3 are comparable to western tanks. The modernized T-62s are nowhere near as good as western tanks but will still be a major threat due to their large numbers.
We also know Russia is massively expanding its army because they have been establishing new units.
Here is just one example, the 44th Army Corps:
Which even western sources noted.
This is a newly formed Army Corps.
Russia even formed a new Motor Rifle Regiment just a week ago:
People forget that most of the Russian Armed Forces is not taking part in the Special Military Operation. The majority of soldiers in Ukraine are from irregular volunteer formations not from regular Russian military units. This is well shown by the losses.
Motorized Rifles: 6,457
VDV: 3,257
Naval Infantry: 1,305
Tank Crew: 1,806
Artillery: 851
Special Forces: 736
Engineering: 291
Navy: 291
VVS: 265
Other: 957
Total: 16,216
Source: MediaZona
This shows that the losses of Russian regulars is actually quite low. Including irregulars, the losses would be almost one hundred thousand as per the same source. This shows that Russia is mostly using irregulars.
Fog of war ? Did you see these ?
The total combat losses of the enemy (russia) from (...)
2022 feb 24 to 2025 Mar. 27
https://lemmy.world/post/27444482
personnel 908890
tanks 10438
troop carrying AFV 21701
artillery systems 25265
MLRS 1343
anti aircraft systems 1118
aircrafts 370
helicopters 335
UAV 30926
cruise missiles 3121
boats 28
submarine 1
vehicles & fuel tanks 42070
special equipment 3787
if your sources diverge, please choose only one of these numbers, the best established one, (# of lost tanks ?) with a different source (only one souce) for comparison.
