Germany is now deporting pro-Palestine EU citizens. This is a chilling new step | Hanno Hauenstein
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Germany has recently taken a chilling new step, signalling its willingness to use political views as grounds to curb migration. Authorities are now moving to deport foreign nationals for participating in pro-Palestine actions. As I reported this week in the Intercept, four people in Berlin – three EU citizens and one US citizen – are set to be deported over their involvement in demonstrations against Israel’s war on Gaza. None of the four have been convicted of a crime, and yet the authorities are seeking to simply throw them out of the country.
The accusations against them include aggravated breach of the peace and obstruction of a police arrest. Reports from last year suggest that one of the actions they were alleged to have been involved in included breaking into a university building and threatening people with objects that could have been used as potential weapons.
But the deportation orders go further. They cite a broader list of alleged behaviours: chanting slogans such as “Free Gaza” and “From the river to the sea, Palestine will be free”, joining road blockades (a tactic frequently used by climate activists), and calling a police officer a “fascist”. Read closely, the real charge appears to be something more basic: protest itself.
And with Nazi Germany back, it's officialy over for this world. I don't see how weare supposed to fight back.
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Y'all have your heads so deep in the sand you can't feel your anus imploding. you are the product if using a free service such as Lemmy or Reddit
You think a person in a position of power won't let power get to their head? Especially in decentralized, anonymous online forum?
Well, power didn't get to my head as a discord mod. I hate being called "boss" too.
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So arrest them and charge them with a crime?
Seeking asylum is not a ticket to wreak havoc at no risk
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Would you be so mind as to provide the sources proving these individuals did all the things you said? They aren’t being criminally indicted for any of these things.
I’m quite surprise you took time to write a comment this long with so many different words to say nothing of substance.
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Liability for crimes committed during protests must be personal and based on evidence that the individual either committed or intended to commit unlawful acts. Participation in a protest alone cannot be the basis for criminal suspicion or charges unless there is reasonable evidence linking the individual to specific offenses.
The right to protest peacefully is protected under international human rights law, such as Article 11 of the European Convention on Human Rights. Courts have ruled that participants retain this right even if violence occurs during the protest, provided they did not engage in or intend violent acts themselves.
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Oh I think in Germany it’s actually a huge problem that no one really feels like they are represented by anyone in the government, even the party they voted for. It’s the biggest reason the AFD is so popular: People wanted an alternative to the status quo, no matter what it is. Because they feel like "die da oben" (like "they up there") have always decided against the interests of the average guy. So actually, mistrust in the government is the cause of the AFD, not its solution.
In my comment I was actually not even thinking about the politicians, just the "majority" as in more than 50% of people. Not the current majority in parliament or anything like that.
Germany actually has a pretty big protest culture, at least I see them so regularly that it’s a very normal part of public life.
But many people are either too content with their life to complain or even be interested in something else (you could also call it lazy and ignorant tbh), or they are so disillusioned that they don’t believe they could ever change something. It’s the same in most western countries to be fair.
I absolutely agree with you about what we should do in regards to Israel, and I think most people in Germany actually also do. But what would happen on the international floor if Germany suddenly started saying we should arrest Israel’s top politician, stop supporting their "defense", and openly accuse them of genocide? It’s an honest question: Do you think we could? Without the whole world scolding us to not forget our history? I personally think Germany doesn’t even have the freedom of choice in this topic, no matter what we as a country think is right.
But what would happen on the international floor if Germany suddenly started saying we should arrest Israel’s top politician,
I think telling Netenyahu that he's safe to travel to Germany because they won't enforce the ICJ arrest warrant is a horrendous, terrible piece of international PR. Of course Germany should arrest him if he comes to Germany. He has an arrest warrant outstanding on him to stand trial for war crimes. Since when is Germany a place for people to evade justice.
Germany should be seen to respect the rule of law. Not tell the ICJ it has no jurisdiction and harbour someone wanted on war crime charges. Let the international court take that problem away from them. It's not on Germany to decide. That's the courts job through due process. If he's not guilty, let the court make that decision.
Anything else is German arrogance.
stop supporting their "defense",
They can limit their support to only non-aggressive aspects. Don't supply funds or weapons. Supply medical aid, infrastructure support, etc and do the same for Gaza. Be on the side of the innocents caught up in the violence.
and openly accuse them of genocide?
Friends tell friends when they're in the wrong. Friends tell friends when they're acting irrationally through anger, fear and hatred. This is especially true if that friend has been there themselves as they can offer a perspective others can not.
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Seeking asylum is not a ticket to wreak havoc at no risk
We're talking about citizens here, Chungus. Citizenship imparts a set of rights and responsibilities. It's not an easy thing to get. And we're not supposed to have different tiers of citizenship, where some citizens are more equal than others. Legally speaking, a naturalized citizen is supposed to be indistinguishable from a native born one.
But with actions like this, you are saying that isn't true. You can immigrate to a country, leave your whole family and life behind, and dedicate yourself fully and passionately to your new home. But it doesn't matter. You'll always be a second-class citizen. You will be treated differently by the legal system than a native born citizen. A native citizen won't be punished with exile for an act of petty vandalism, but you will be.
This shows that Germany has truly abandoned, at a fundamental level, the idea of equal justice under the law. It is once again going down the path of Fascism, where citizens receive different rights based on their ethnicity, religion, and immigration history. Once you start having different tiers of citizenship, with different levels of protection, things get dark very quickly.
And while the injustice starts with immigrants, once you've established the precedent that the protections of citizenship can be arbitrarily stripped from people based on political convenience and pressure? It's a short ride to the gas chambers. This is literally the legal foundation of the Holocaust.
You learned nothing from history, and you are doomed to repeat it.
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Same as your argument that talks about something unrelated to whatever happened in Germany. Strawman argument, like you said.
And you deleted your edit, hypocrite racist fucking asshole.
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We're talking about citizens here, Chungus. Citizenship imparts a set of rights and responsibilities. It's not an easy thing to get. And we're not supposed to have different tiers of citizenship, where some citizens are more equal than others. Legally speaking, a naturalized citizen is supposed to be indistinguishable from a native born one.
But with actions like this, you are saying that isn't true. You can immigrate to a country, leave your whole family and life behind, and dedicate yourself fully and passionately to your new home. But it doesn't matter. You'll always be a second-class citizen. You will be treated differently by the legal system than a native born citizen. A native citizen won't be punished with exile for an act of petty vandalism, but you will be.
This shows that Germany has truly abandoned, at a fundamental level, the idea of equal justice under the law. It is once again going down the path of Fascism, where citizens receive different rights based on their ethnicity, religion, and immigration history. Once you start having different tiers of citizenship, with different levels of protection, things get dark very quickly.
And while the injustice starts with immigrants, once you've established the precedent that the protections of citizenship can be arbitrarily stripped from people based on political convenience and pressure? It's a short ride to the gas chambers. This is literally the legal foundation of the Holocaust.
You learned nothing from history, and you are doomed to repeat it.
If you can't even stay out of severe trouble and be grateful for the asylum you don't deserve your asylum spot. Many people are waiting to replace you.
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The author of the article links to their own earlier article in the Intercept that goes in detail: https://theintercept.com/2025/03/31/germany-gaza-protesters-deport/
The only event that tied the four cases together was the allegation that the protesters participated in the university occupation, which involved property damage, and alleged obstruction of an arrest — a so-called de-arrest aimed at blocking a fellow protesters’ detention. None of the protesters are accused of any particular acts of vandalism or the de-arrest at the university. Instead, the deportation order cites the suspicion that they took part in a coordinated group action. (The Free University told The Intercept it had no knowledge of the deportation orders.)
Some of the allegations are minor. Two, for example, are accused of calling a police officer “fascist” — insulting an officer, which is a crime. Three are accused of demonstrating with groups chanting slogans like “From the river to the sea, Palestine Will be Free” — which was outlawed last year in Germany — and “free Palestine.” Authorities also claim all four shouted antisemitic or anti-Israel slogans, though none are specified.
Two are accused of grabbing an officers’ or another protesters’ arm in an attempt to stop arrests at the train station sit-in.
O’Brien, one of the Irish citizens, is the only one of the four whose deportation order included a charge – the accusation that he called a police officer a “fascist” – that has been brought before a criminal court in Berlin, where he was acquitted.
All four are accused, without evidence, of supporting Hamas, a group Germany has designated as a terrorist organization.
Thanks. A few follow up questions. First, who is causing the deportation attempt. In the US we know these all come top down from trump. But is the executive branch in germany also in the hands of anti-immigration management? And is that the executive branch?
Second, is guilt by association like this a thing for German citizens?
And last, are these guys like university students? Or are they like tourist who came to protest or something?
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Thanks. A few follow up questions. First, who is causing the deportation attempt. In the US we know these all come top down from trump. But is the executive branch in germany also in the hands of anti-immigration management? And is that the executive branch?
Second, is guilt by association like this a thing for German citizens?
And last, are these guys like university students? Or are they like tourist who came to protest or something?
Thanks.Are you asking me to play the role of a search engine for you?
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Are you asking me to play the role of a search engine for you?
People have commented that there is a lot of misinformation out there on this. The best sources would be german sources probably. But I don’t know which sources in germany (or even the EU) are reliable. I know the US sources are NOT reliable on this subject.
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People have commented that there is a lot of misinformation out there on this. The best sources would be german sources probably. But I don’t know which sources in germany (or even the EU) are reliable. I know the US sources are NOT reliable on this subject.
However, the record of German institutions to crack down on dissident Jewish voices(*) is a very good indicator of what's going on here. Now, I'm not saying that any of these people are little saints, or that they did nothing questionable, but that there is a systemic bias in Germany against pro-Palestinian activism. Which is the more burning point than counting pennies of the particularities of each individual legal case.
(*) such as Masha Gessen, Nancy Fraser, Yuval Abraham, Omri Boehm and others.
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However, the record of German institutions to crack down on dissident Jewish voices(*) is a very good indicator of what's going on here. Now, I'm not saying that any of these people are little saints, or that they did nothing questionable, but that there is a systemic bias in Germany against pro-Palestinian activism. Which is the more burning point than counting pennies of the particularities of each individual legal case.
(*) such as Masha Gessen, Nancy Fraser, Yuval Abraham, Omri Boehm and others.
So.. me being a yankee... why is that? In the US it has to do with money of course. Selling weapons to Isreal makes a lot of people rich. But also I have been told that a lot of the power people in our democratic party are Jewish or something.
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And you deleted your edit, hypocrite racist fucking asshole.
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I am not even sure why as a trans person one wants to support an islamic-extremist and authoritarian organization like Hamas. Honestly, I dont get it.
I mean yeah I dont want to make a case of supporting the other side either. But just think would rather wants you dead, Israel, or Hamas? I think I pretty much know the answer.
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But what would happen on the international floor if Germany suddenly started saying we should arrest Israel’s top politician,
I think telling Netenyahu that he's safe to travel to Germany because they won't enforce the ICJ arrest warrant is a horrendous, terrible piece of international PR. Of course Germany should arrest him if he comes to Germany. He has an arrest warrant outstanding on him to stand trial for war crimes. Since when is Germany a place for people to evade justice.
Germany should be seen to respect the rule of law. Not tell the ICJ it has no jurisdiction and harbour someone wanted on war crime charges. Let the international court take that problem away from them. It's not on Germany to decide. That's the courts job through due process. If he's not guilty, let the court make that decision.
Anything else is German arrogance.
stop supporting their "defense",
They can limit their support to only non-aggressive aspects. Don't supply funds or weapons. Supply medical aid, infrastructure support, etc and do the same for Gaza. Be on the side of the innocents caught up in the violence.
and openly accuse them of genocide?
Friends tell friends when they're in the wrong. Friends tell friends when they're acting irrationally through anger, fear and hatred. This is especially true if that friend has been there themselves as they can offer a perspective others can not.
Again, I agree with everything above, I also think Germany is doing the wrong thing. In your last paragraph you say exactly what was my argument: Germany acts like it has a debt to repay. I can say from the perspective of a German that that is exactly what everyone here feels like is expected of us. Eternal atonement. Repaying what cannot be repaid. This has never changed since Germany lost WWII.
You have to consider that Germanys position regarding international relations is unique. The allied states gave us back our freedom not under the condition of being friends with Israel, but essentially owing a debt. Nobody ever let us forget what would happen if we "got out of line" again.
That is not only true on the level of international politics, but also in everyday life. When you travel to the US, people will straight up ask about the Nazi-Autobahn or whether you are a Nazi yourself. In Poland, people just might be a bit more unfriendly to you because of what your country did to theirs. In many places of the world you can buy "history pieces", from SS emblems to signed copies of "Mein Kampf". The whole world still kind of thinks of the Nazis when they talk about Germany, and if its even just 1% of what they think, it's still there. Like, no offense taken, but I don't know about any other country in this position. Russia, the US, Great Britain, France, even Japan or Italy. I don't think any of these countries' citizens get asked uncomfortable questions about their countries past when on vacation. Their children do not grow up in the knowledge that they will have to bear the sins of their country, and put them on their children too.
So, Germany accepted this role, these expectations, and does its best to keep to that. Nobody here thinks it would be internationally accepted if we "emancipated" ourselves from this duty. I think many Germans want to, at least in my social bubble. But do you think we could, without any repercussions?
I think what we need is absolution, forgiveness, a new beginning with no strings attached. A real, equal friendship between Israel and Germany. Trust. Otherwise we will just stay paralyzed by our infinite moral debt. I don't think this will happen in our lifetimes. Not with the current Israel, the current US, the current Germany.
TL;DR: I wanted to give an perspective on why Germanys position is kind of unique in this world. It is one of the biggest economies, a sovereign state, but still not free in decisions regarding Israel.
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Is it irrelevant though?
Lets take it to an extreme:
Imagine in Gaza there would be a Nazi regime. Nazis who hate trans people and want them dead. Nazis living there with their families, innocent children etc.I Understand that it would be worthwhile stopping war actions on all those innocent souls, but would I actively advocate for the Nazi party ruling this imaginary Gaza strip? Certainly not.
Hence, get your act together. Support an end of the war on Gaza, support innocent people. Dont support Hamas!
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Gaza has less autonomy than Belarus.
At this moment maybe. But they had, in leave time, more autonomy than Puerto Rico.
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Again, I agree with everything above, I also think Germany is doing the wrong thing. In your last paragraph you say exactly what was my argument: Germany acts like it has a debt to repay. I can say from the perspective of a German that that is exactly what everyone here feels like is expected of us. Eternal atonement. Repaying what cannot be repaid. This has never changed since Germany lost WWII.
You have to consider that Germanys position regarding international relations is unique. The allied states gave us back our freedom not under the condition of being friends with Israel, but essentially owing a debt. Nobody ever let us forget what would happen if we "got out of line" again.
That is not only true on the level of international politics, but also in everyday life. When you travel to the US, people will straight up ask about the Nazi-Autobahn or whether you are a Nazi yourself. In Poland, people just might be a bit more unfriendly to you because of what your country did to theirs. In many places of the world you can buy "history pieces", from SS emblems to signed copies of "Mein Kampf". The whole world still kind of thinks of the Nazis when they talk about Germany, and if its even just 1% of what they think, it's still there. Like, no offense taken, but I don't know about any other country in this position. Russia, the US, Great Britain, France, even Japan or Italy. I don't think any of these countries' citizens get asked uncomfortable questions about their countries past when on vacation. Their children do not grow up in the knowledge that they will have to bear the sins of their country, and put them on their children too.
So, Germany accepted this role, these expectations, and does its best to keep to that. Nobody here thinks it would be internationally accepted if we "emancipated" ourselves from this duty. I think many Germans want to, at least in my social bubble. But do you think we could, without any repercussions?
I think what we need is absolution, forgiveness, a new beginning with no strings attached. A real, equal friendship between Israel and Germany. Trust. Otherwise we will just stay paralyzed by our infinite moral debt. I don't think this will happen in our lifetimes. Not with the current Israel, the current US, the current Germany.
TL;DR: I wanted to give an perspective on why Germanys position is kind of unique in this world. It is one of the biggest economies, a sovereign state, but still not free in decisions regarding Israel.
I get where you're coming from. It's a hard legacy to inherit, but honestly most European countries have terrible events in their past. Germany's is just the most recent.
It's sad that travelling as a German is so awkward. Americans can be ignorant jerks, so that doesn't surprise me much. Few of them know how mainstream Nazi thinking was there before they entered the war. They treat us British as occupiers that they had to kick out, rather than the ancestral home of their founding fathers. Best to brush them off.
With many other places WW2 kicked off a series of occupations that only finished with the fall of the Soviet Union. It's still raw.
I think what we need is absolution, forgiveness, a new beginning with no strings attached. A real, equal friendship between Israel and Germany. Trust.
There is no absolution. There's just time.
(Germany needs a good therapist)
You're focusing on Israel as being the answer. Israel is not the Jewish diasporas. What Israel wants is not the same thing as what the Jewish people want. What about all the Jews around the world that see Israel killing in their name and are disgusted by it? They then see Germany by Israel's side?
Ukraine, on the other hand...defending a nation against a clear aggressor. A foreign policy slam-dunk, yet it's France and the UK taking the lead.
Be a rock. Be solid. A good world citizen. Be worthy of the world's trust and then you will be trusted.
