How effective are life jackets in rapidly flowing deep flood waters?
-
I am surely not a swimmer, but after the recent tragic flooding in Texas, it got me and my roommate wondering...
As I understand it, rapid flood waters will likely crush you to death with debris, or you'll get stuck underwater. A vest won't save you from either of those.
But if you have one, wear it. Swimming ability won't help you if you're unconscious or exhausted. Ideally, you stay out of the water, but if you can't, you'll be better off with a life jacket on.
-
Life jackets also get caught on things. So if it's wide open and free from anything to snag on, great, enjoy the terrifying not-lazy river ride. If there are things to snag on, like I assume the Texas flash floods, then a lifejacket would also be a liability.
I've done some downriver rapids canoe/kayak stuff, by no means an expert nor even knowledgeable hobbyist. On a certain river trip, fast-flowing with lots of submerged trees, they had us drill unclipping jackets and wriggling out of them while submerged.
If the water conditions are so bad you would consider a life jacket a liability, you’re just fucked. The debris your jacket could get caught on is the stuff that’ll knock you insensate, and then you drown
-
I am surely not a swimmer, but after the recent tragic flooding in Texas, it got me and my roommate wondering...
wrote last edited by [email protected]You want a Type-1, made to keep an unconscious adult on their back with their head out of the water for an extended period of time. I use type 3 when I canoe on the lake. I'm not a whitewater enthusiast. The type 1 are made for offshore shit where the person might be knocked out when they fall off the boat.
But yeah, in a flash flood it's only going to keep you on top. Probably get smashed by a tree or a car or something. Best to stay out of floodwater.
edit: but better a type 3 or even a ring than nothing. If I was in a hurricane or flash flood situation I'd rather have a type 1
-
I am surely not a swimmer, but after the recent tragic flooding in Texas, it got me and my roommate wondering...
A life jacket can't effectively protect you against debris, but it can help keep you from drowning from exhaustion as you try to dodge and seek an escape. And if you do die anyway, it could help your body be found, for the sake of those who mourn you.
-
I am surely not a swimmer, but after the recent tragic flooding in Texas, it got me and my roommate wondering...
A life jacket can't effectively protect you against debris, but it can help keep you from drowning from exhaustion as you try to dodge and seek an escape. And if you do die anyway, it could help your body be found, for the sake of those who mourn you.
Also: if it's physically possible for you, please learn to swim.
-
I am surely not a swimmer, but after the recent tragic flooding in Texas, it got me and my roommate wondering...
wrote last edited by [email protected]"It's not that the water is flowing, it's hwat the water brings with it.
-
A life jacket can't effectively protect you against debris, but it can help keep you from drowning from exhaustion as you try to dodge and seek an escape. And if you do die anyway, it could help your body be found, for the sake of those who mourn you.
Also: if it's physically possible for you, please learn to swim.
Thank you and everyone else for all the informative comments!
Back in 2014, I actually did kinda force myself to learn to swim, once, in a deep river with a current. I wasn't all that great at swimming, but I managed to resurface and start swimming towards the shore before someone else swam out to help me.
I think I could have managed to swim to shore myself, but at a struggle as it was my first time ever trying to swim. Regardless, at least I have one experience under my belt.
-
"It's not that the water is flowing, it's hwat the water brings with it.
"If the water is carrying a Volvo, it doesn't matter how many crunches you did that day."
-
Thank you and everyone else for all the informative comments!
Back in 2014, I actually did kinda force myself to learn to swim, once, in a deep river with a current. I wasn't all that great at swimming, but I managed to resurface and start swimming towards the shore before someone else swam out to help me.
I think I could have managed to swim to shore myself, but at a struggle as it was my first time ever trying to swim. Regardless, at least I have one experience under my belt.
wrote last edited by [email protected]I'm impressed with your initiative! But maybe practice some more, in a safer place, with someone who can help you become more efficient at staying afloat and moving easily through the water.
-
I am surely not a swimmer, but after the recent tragic flooding in Texas, it got me and my roommate wondering...
wrote last edited by [email protected]A life jacket is what can help save you once you exhaust yourself fighting against a torrent of water. If you need to do something a bit reckless to save yourself or someone else, then it can help you catch your breath a bit and keep your head above water.
The thing is, if you are needing to rely on a lifejacket, the situation may already be a bit desperate. If you are able to get some kind of an early warning system, then that will go a lot farther at helping you get to safety. Getting a lifejacket could help make a difference if you are in a potential flood zone.
-
Thank you and everyone else for all the informative comments!
Back in 2014, I actually did kinda force myself to learn to swim, once, in a deep river with a current. I wasn't all that great at swimming, but I managed to resurface and start swimming towards the shore before someone else swam out to help me.
I think I could have managed to swim to shore myself, but at a struggle as it was my first time ever trying to swim. Regardless, at least I have one experience under my belt.
With all the care, I would strongly advise you not to go with "you must be in a survival situation to learn to swim" cliché.
Not only is it, well, dangerous, but it also doesn't teach you to swim properly either. If you just try to stay on the surface, you'll expend a ton of energy and can get water in your throat which will complicate things severely.
You should learn to stay on the surface by breathing only. Pick a place with still water (lake? calm sea? pool?) and learn to lay down on your spine without movement. Do it near the shore, of course. Just put your body in a star shape, legs and hands extended, and learn to breathe in a way that allows you to float still. Once you learn it, not only you have improved breathing technique helpful in swimming, but you can also take a rest on water anytime to restore without even having a jacket in the first place.
Then, knowing how to breathe to stay afloat, learn to swim. Now you can save a lot of energy because you don't need much movement to keep you afloat, and you can just swim in the direction you need
-
If the water conditions are so bad you would consider a life jacket a liability, you’re just fucked. The debris your jacket could get caught on is the stuff that’ll knock you insensate, and then you drown
wrote last edited by [email protected]If you're whitewater kayaking, it's not uncommon to have a knife accessible from your PFD.
It can be used to cut any ropes you might be tangled in or (worse case) cut the PFD.
In general, having a knife with you is useful in most emergency situations (and a throw rope, pin kit, plus knowledge of how to use them).
edit: Oops, this was supposed to be a response for the parent thread.
-
"If the water is carrying a Volvo, it doesn't matter how many crunches you did that day."
wrote last edited by [email protected]Idk, this guy might be fine taking on a Volvo.
And there's always adrenaline.
-
Idk, this guy might be fine taking on a Volvo.
And there's always adrenaline.
These silly comments were a reference to this bit.
I got my comment a bit wrong tho. Oh well.
-
As someone who works on ships, it's truly baffling how many "but what if...!? Life jacket bad!" you see in the intertubes.
I have one of these auto-inflaters and I always wear it on deck. Yes, the color will make me more visible to sharks and a myriad of other theoretical hazards, but I still would prefer not to drown.
One important note: if you for some reason need to wear BOTH an inflatable life jacket and a climbing harness (which I sometimes need to do), make sure to put on the climbing harness first. The harness will not give way to an inflating life jacket, but your chest and ability to breathe will.
Vaccine people. Same thing. They will happily start a case and put it against something with 12 more digits of probability behind it and feel like they have specialized knowledge. Dunning kreuger as well.
-
A life jacket can't effectively protect you against debris, but it can help keep you from drowning from exhaustion as you try to dodge and seek an escape. And if you do die anyway, it could help your body be found, for the sake of those who mourn you.
Not exactly true, yes if the debris is bad enough and the current is strong enough, there isn't a lot that will help. BUT if you have a life jacket, even in swiftly moving water, you can lean back and orient your feet downstream and it'll keep your head away from the worst of it.
That would be significantly harder to do without a PFD.
-
Not exactly true, yes if the debris is bad enough and the current is strong enough, there isn't a lot that will help. BUT if you have a life jacket, even in swiftly moving water, you can lean back and orient your feet downstream and it'll keep your head away from the worst of it.
That would be significantly harder to do without a PFD.
Good point. I guess people ought not only to have life jackets, but also trained on how best to use them in rough water. Although they're mostly kept near boats and things. Would having them hung on the cabin walls at Camp Mystic have saved lives? Not all, with whole buildings crashing around in the water, but maybe a few.
-
A life jacket is what can help save you once you exhaust yourself fighting against a torrent of water. If you need to do something a bit reckless to save yourself or someone else, then it can help you catch your breath a bit and keep your head above water.
The thing is, if you are needing to rely on a lifejacket, the situation may already be a bit desperate. If you are able to get some kind of an early warning system, then that will go a lot farther at helping you get to safety. Getting a lifejacket could help make a difference if you are in a potential flood zone.
A warning like a map of where the most dangerous fast moving flood waters will be? A place where cabins should not be built?
-
A warning like a map of where the most dangerous fast moving flood waters will be? A place where cabins should not be built?
You would hope that no houses would be built in potential flooding zones, but that involves pesky things like ‘regulations’ or ‘caring about other peoples lives’.
::: spoiler Tap for spoiler
(/s)
::: -
A warning like a map of where the most dangerous fast moving flood waters will be? A place where cabins should not be built?
wrote last edited by [email protected]A map? Hahaha, that's almost funny!
Coming from South Mississippi, it's up to Alabama as to whenever they decide to open their flood gates as to how many feet of water we get in a flood.
Hurricane Sandy flooded us deeper than Hurricane Katrina. Alabama has proven more than once that they don't give a shit about us down here.
Flood zone maps are only useful when those pesky humans don't intervene and open up flood gates and dams and shit. Oh, and humans literally created those things.
Nature is no longer strictly in control...
