Is it racist to oppose illegal immigrants?
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Yes.
Just ask yourself why there is even a barrier to entry in the first place. Prejudices and paranoia.
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It depends.
It would be racist to oppose immigrants from Sudan whilst welcoming those from Ukraine.
In my opinion, it is not racist to oppose illegal immigration per se.
Especially if those immigrants would benefit from a social system that you pay into.It is wrong, however to blame the immigrants, as it would be the system that is the problem.
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Every time I meet someone who opposes illegal immigration but claims to support legal immigration I ask one question. If the law changed so that all immigration was legal, you'd be fine with it, right?
Nobody so far has been fine with it. I conclude that the question of legality is a dodge for people who are embarrassed about their actual motives.
Oh my God the HEMMING and HAWING when suggesting easier immigration to one of these bigots.
They will do anything to avoid answering that question. It's really disgusting
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No as it's a fair national security concern
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No, not on it's own, but it's rarely on its own. In the US opposition to illegal immigrants and racism tracks nearly one to one.
One could imagine a country where illegal immigration itself was a distinct problem, where the society was balanced in such a way that legal immigration was at an optimal rate and additional people coming into the country had downsides that outstripped the positives, when though, for example, the immigrants were of the same culture/class/standing as the existing citizens.
The US, on the other hand, is nowhere near an optimal legal immigration rate, even though we benefit pretty significantly from both legal and illegal immigration. Illegal immigrants, for example, contribute significantly to the economy while not drawing 'as many' benefits away. Overwhelmingly the actual arguments against illegal immigration are grounded in cultural differences and language and, to put it simply, the desire for one class to want a reason to consider themselves better than another class by an easily recognizable yardstick.
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Yes.
Just ask yourself why there is even a barrier to entry in the first place. Prejudices and paranoia.
This very much seems like a Chesterton's Fence issue.
Using the US/Mexico example - if the US didn't have some kind of restriction to its borders, we would expect Mexican cartel influence to spill over the border much more easily.
Or another example - suppose Ukraine had completely unrestricted flow across its border with Russia. Then Russia wants to invade. What do they do? They just have 100,000 soldiers walk across the border dressed as civilians, then launch their attack across the country.
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Absolutely not.
I really do believe that America should fix America first before it decides to try and 'help' other nations. The problem is, obviously, the wrong people are in place and doing it all wrong as possibly be.
Illegal Immigration has been a thorn in America's side for a couple decades now in recent memory. The only ones who benefit from it, are obviously corporations who love the idea of cheap labor in the form of modern-day slavery. The immigrants who come here, are not seen as people, they are seen as assets. And it is glaring, how those assets are ironically seen as more valuable than natural born workers who got hired.
Don't believe me? I've witnessed it where someone who immigrated here, got to take multiple months off from work and come back to retain her job. Meanwhile, people like me, have had to practically work and weed my way through the system to make sure I have days off, to make sure I keep my job secure. Tell me how in that way is it fair. There are probably numerous examples where naturally born citizens are sometimes treated lesser than, than those who came here from other countries and picked up similar positions to work.
But certain groups of people brush all of that under the rug and play the label game instead, rather than addressing the problem. It's easier for people to side-step these issues when they aren't the one experiencing them, so it must be comfy to think radically as if they don't exist.
And I don't really buy into the logic that the United States, and ONLY the United States mind you, should have open borders. Countries are allowed to have borders and keep them safeguard, it's been a thing for CENTURIES! But because it's the 2010s or 2020s, no no, we have to discard that ideal and apply it only to the United States. I'm sorry but the United States are as allowed as any other country in the world, to have borders and secure them as they see fit.
My point of the matter is, is that if you're going to migrate to the United States, you're expected to assimilate. Not be cherry picking and expecting people to bow to your will just BECAUSE you migrated, it doesn't make you that special. You don't charge over into places like Japan, Germany or other countries and expect them to bow to your will just BECAUSE you migrated from the United States, do you? If so, you're part of that problem.
And if you don't want to assimilate, then you're best being shipped back. Otherwise, it adds to the problem and I think the whole honeypot melting thing that the US Government has tried pushing around for a while now, has been a fundamental failure. Because now it has been completely politicized and only has made more people argumentative over the issue when it should have just been simpler.
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Every time I meet someone who opposes illegal immigration but claims to support legal immigration I ask one question. If the law changed so that all immigration was legal, you'd be fine with it, right?
Nobody so far has been fine with it. I conclude that the question of legality is a dodge for people who are embarrassed about their actual motives.
I support legal immigration, I empathize with illegal immigration (and think the laws could use adjustment in both directions)...but I don't think all immigration should be legal.
And no, it doesn't change if they're from "a Western country" or from somewhere that people look different from the majority in my country.
We have rising unemployment among citizens, especially young people, yet corporations are taking advantage of immigrants in various ways. And immigrants of all kinds -- legal, grey area, and illegal immigrants.
We are selling the idea of a lifestyle to people in other countries that isn't attainable unless you're part of the top quintile (or possibly an even smaller group) of income. Then they come here, bringing their university educations, and are competing for jobs against high schoolers.
I'm all about people coming to live in my country. But we're doing a disservice to immigrants through our laws/regulations and our corporations. And people who are here illegally are usually the biggest victims; the most exploited.
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Every time I meet someone who opposes illegal immigration but claims to support legal immigration I ask one question. If the law changed so that all immigration was legal, you'd be fine with it, right?
Nobody so far has been fine with it. I conclude that the question of legality is a dodge for people who are embarrassed about their actual motives.
I also would not be fine with it.
Having a barrier to entry is what keeps most of the dipshits out. There are dipshits in every country. I don't want to have to deal with another country's dipshits - we have enough to deal with on our own.
Exactly what the barriers to entry are should be reformed so that they make sense and allow all people in easily if they meet some straightforward requirements.
Borders have existed since paleolithic tribes staked out perimeters around their camps and established hunting territory boundaries with other tribes. Is it possible that we will someday live in a world completely free of restricted travel? Sure! But abolishing all barriers to entry across national boundaries tomorrow with a snap of the fingers would be a disaster.
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I am yet to hear a justification for opposing illegal immigration that doesn't tie back into racism or racial prejudice, let alone a justification that actually makes sense if you take it apart.
Someone prove me wrong, and I'll change my mind.
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In the US and many other countries, immigration violations are not crimes. Therefore, those immigrants are not illegal. It is actually a civil infraction, like a parking ticket... So, your question reveals hidden xenophobic bias. That alone is immoral. Is it racist in itself? Probably. It is very difficult to be xenophobic without also being racist.
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Except it's not illegal. Get your facts straight, please.
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Except it's not illegal. Get your facts straight, please.
Sorry, not sorry, blocking radicals. You're just energy vampires.
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In the US and many other countries, immigration violations are not crimes. Therefore, those immigrants are not illegal. It is actually a civil infraction, like a parking ticket... So, your question reveals hidden xenophobic bias. That alone is immoral. Is it racist in itself? Probably. It is very difficult to be xenophobic without also being racist.
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Where, and to what degree relative to Arabs or Latin Americans or whatever?
Like sure, you can find someone who said it was bad somewhere, but even in places like Romania or Poland they were never the main target of the xenophobic rage.
I live in SC. There was a big uproar about it and an even bigger one that the news shrugged its shoulders and went "eh, not really news worth."
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Except it's not illegal. Get your facts straight, please.
Not true is any sense, even the technical. Entering the US illegally, or overstaying a visa, is, at best, a civil offense. Still illegal. Diving into what constitutes a criminal offense gets sticky in a hurry.
My wife is a brown, legal immigrant, so I looked this up, read a bit, briefly. Again, it's complicated, and IANAL, so if the laws might apply, give a look. Bit in no case is entering without documents or overstaying "not illegal".
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Finally. Someone willing to talk about the issue other than, "ALL IMMIGRANTS GOOD!" And if you don't believe that, you're a racist fuck.
Been beat up, here and on reddit, in past years for stating that, yes, we had a nightmare at the southern border. Officials were overwhelmed and under financed, immigrants faced a fucking humanitarian disaster. People were suffering and dying and what did liberals have to say? "Man, fuck you, it's not true, it's Fox News propaganda." Meanwhile, the population of Chicago flooded in, year after year. How the fuck are we supposed to create the infrastructure and housing for America's 3rd largest city, every year. (I got numbers to back that, but I doubt any here give a shit.)
And JFC, no liberals are bitching about the modern-day slavery aspect. I've seen very few positing that we should go after business owners. "Just pay them fairly!" All for it, but the grocery bill is going to explode. And we're just now seeing the results of running them off, only just begun.
Yes, only Americans are racists for wanting to control our borders. Meanwhile, in Europe, where anti-immigration sentiment and protests are spiking... silence. (I think this is mostly down to overpopulation, but that's a whole 'nother rant.)
Don't start me on assimilation. My wife is Filipino. Her and all of her friends have assimilated nicely, thank you very much. Meanwhile, the dudes at the taco truck can't take an order, from a very limited menu, in English. Had always figured people like that were brand new. We took one of my wife's coworker's kayaking. Cool guy. Gay Honduran, walked 30-days to get here. Fucking tough enough for me! He didn't know words like, "boy", "girl", "year", "please". Assumed he just got here, OK with that. Nah. He has been here for 5 years.
We need immigrants, but we are fucking it up so badly I can't get my head around the stupidity.
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No, not on it's own, but it's rarely on its own. In the US opposition to illegal immigrants and racism tracks nearly one to one.
One could imagine a country where illegal immigration itself was a distinct problem, where the society was balanced in such a way that legal immigration was at an optimal rate and additional people coming into the country had downsides that outstripped the positives, when though, for example, the immigrants were of the same culture/class/standing as the existing citizens.
The US, on the other hand, is nowhere near an optimal legal immigration rate, even though we benefit pretty significantly from both legal and illegal immigration. Illegal immigrants, for example, contribute significantly to the economy while not drawing 'as many' benefits away. Overwhelmingly the actual arguments against illegal immigration are grounded in cultural differences and language and, to put it simply, the desire for one class to want a reason to consider themselves better than another class by an easily recognizable yardstick.
I wonder how old you are. Seems you're missing the population issue. I can go on and on, but I'm 54 and I've seen demographics and population change radically. Fine with the demographic changes, but I can see some being alarmed that "their" country is being taken away. Don't agree, but I get the sentiment.
As I've seen the planet's population more than double in my life, seen the countryside paved over for strip malls, I'm screaming, "NO MORE FUCKING PEOPLE!" Who's to blame? Can you see how it's easier to blame the "other"?
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I feel like if you're asking then you're searching for validation. A sort of way to not feel guilty about being racist. Tell me, what bothers you most about immigrants? This country wouldn't exist if it weren't for immigrants
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It depends.
It would be racist to oppose immigrants from Sudan whilst welcoming those from Ukraine.
In my opinion, it is not racist to oppose illegal immigration per se.
Especially if those immigrants would benefit from a social system that you pay into.It is wrong, however to blame the immigrants, as it would be the system that is the problem.
Illegal immigrants get jack shit out of our social system. But conservatives tell you they do!
In any case, you're right, it's the system. We've got legalized slavery and how do you fight the rich over that? And how do we actually pay these people without fucking our grocery bill?
I'm afraid it all has to crash, hard, before we reform anything..
