So how do you feel about the whole Charlie Kirk divide?
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I don’t support him being murdered whoever is doing the killing.
I think we should focus on the class war and not this right vs left bullshit.
Left vs Right is part of the class war. Class consciousness is a political concept of the Left, a concept that the Right has invested a tremendous amount of time and effort to subvert.
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I don't agree with him. But he shouldn't have been shot. His whole thing was about discussing politics in a civilised manner. That shooter could have came down and debated him.
The video of him dying is just sad. It just shows how inhumane it is.
He wasn't even a politician, just an internet content creator. They just made a martyr.
His whole thing was about discussing politics in a civilised manner.
No, his whole thing was personally hiding behind civility while empowering and promoting people and ideas that are steeped in political violence.
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Left vs Right is part of the class war. Class consciousness is a political concept of the Left, a concept that the Right has invested a tremendous amount of time and effort to subvert.
Super rich vs everybody else if you want to argue semantics.
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Super rich vs everybody else if you want to argue semantics.
That's still a political dispute between the left and right?
You can't address class without engaging in politics.
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I do think the very fact that he wasn't so high up is probably a big contributor as to why people are so divided. I remember the sympathy for the United CEO being pretty much limited to talking heads and the other Billionaires.
We're seeing much more vehement discussion on this one
The CEO was basically a nobody. A rich nobody, certainly, but a nobody. I didn't know of his existence before he was killed, and I'm sure I'm in the same group as a majority of Americans and the rest of the world. Likewise, I don't know how who replaced him. So why would there be division? You'll get some objective, impersonal "He was a father and husband, this is terrible," and some objective, somewhat more emotional "He made his money by refusing sick people care," but there isn't a lot of arguing because even though it was very real, it's still in the realm of the hypothetical for most people. Even kids killed in a school half a world away is more real, and more emotional, for most people because they have kids, will have kids, or were a kid in a situation not too dissimilar, and it could have been them if not for their different circumstances.
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I'm going to challenge you all, right here, right now. Put down the thought of what's right, what's wrong, how people should be reacting, ect. I'm an apathetic bastard and I really could care less either way.
What I have noticed though is there's a LOT of divide on this one, more than usual. Lemmy's pretty homogenous but go outside to Facebook, Instagram, reddit, any of the mainstream places, hell, even talking about it with friends or family, you get some really differing views and people seem ready to discard longtime relationships over it. Hell, I've seen it happen 3 times now so far.
°So what do you think, take off the politics hat for a second and put on the sociology hat. Take a breath, and examine your surroundings.
°How does what's going on make you feel, sad? Angry? Scared, tired or relieved?
°What do you think this says about which direction our society is going, have you got any predictions? Any old timers who have been through near societal collapses before want to throw in their perspective?
I'm genuinely interested in what you all think
wrote last edited by [email protected]Rightists have spent decades building and nurturing a fascist culture. Fascism has well defined and recognizable traits, including machismo, action for actions sake, weapon obsession, derision of pacifism and diversity and science, dying a hero, and demonizing out groups and dissenters.
Violence is the end result. They use fear of violence to seize control, while stoking and promoting violence among their followers, which results in perpetuation of real violence, which creates an escalating cycle of violence. There is a reason that almost all shooters are radicalized rightists. It is because their culture has carefully groomed those traits into them.
On the flip side, leftist violence erupts only when people are pushed far beyond their breaking point. We are not there yet, but the rightists have escalated the cycle of violence to levels where we are getting close.
Charlie Kirk was a victim of his own rhetoric, his own political violence, and his own stochastic terrorism. I weep for the world, because his hateful, dangerous, violent ideals will live long into the future even without him. And with a false martyrdom narrative now in place, many other hateful, violent terrorists will spring up to further accelerate the cycle of violence, fascism, and oppression.
We are all fucked. Not just the US, the world.
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His whole thing was about discussing politics in a civilised manner.
No, his whole thing was personally hiding behind civility while empowering and promoting people and ideas that are steeped in political violence.
I didn't know much about the fellow he seems interesting
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Some guy who apparently made his living by saying inflammatory things if you want the base boiled down version
"some guy"
He was a state-sponsored Christofascist propagandist. Be honest if you're going to summarize.
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I didn't know much about the fellow he seems interesting
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You're saying you have no one close to you who disagrees with you? Possibly someone who you were surprised to learn that about? I certainly see many people in a slightly different light now, I probably won't stop being friends with them but it's odd seeing them react a certain way
I've completely cut out any family that supports the Trump administration, personally. Fuck em. There's no space in my life for bigots.
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We need people that will safeguard certain lines that may not be crossed.
Exactly.
"We finally won."
What did it cost?
"Our humanity"
If people are so willing to cross those lines, what are we even doing or trying to uphold?
Thanks, I love it.
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wrote last edited by [email protected]
Glad this article includes context. It'll help my research. Thank you.
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I'm not American, so this is an outside perspective I guess. I had never heard of Charlie Kirk before he was shot, and it's been interesting watching it all play out. Ring wing leap to assuming it was a leftist attack, with a huge amount of violent rhetoric; suspect arrested & turns out to be from conservative background; trickle of suggestions he might be further to the right of Kirk.
I've learned a new word: Groyper.
Meanwhile in the UK we've got a kind of fascism-lite going on, with a "socialist" party in charge that's leaning to the right of Thatcher in order to attract the votes of bigots. There's a massive right-wing rally going on in London right now, with a couple of anti-fascist, anti-racist counter protests as well. https://www.theguardian.com/world/video/2025/sep/13/aerial-footage-shows-scale-of-unite-the-kingdom-rally-video
The shooter is confirmed to be “far left”, quit the bullshit.
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A self-elected mouthpiece that thrives on spreading hatred that has cause immerse damage and suffering for innocent people is shot by one of his own people. He died by consequence of the violence he was promoting against others.
The only ones I sympathise with are his children because they didn't choose their parents and they will have his legacy on their shoulders. His wife and his friends and colleagues and his followers can go fuck themselves ass to eye with a spork.
shot by one of his own people
Charlie Kirk was a radical far left supporter of “antifa”?
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I'm not divided. This is a republican on Republican crime. Fuck them, let them eat themselves for all I care.
Since when are radicalized far left antifa supporters “republicans”?
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So what're your thoughts now we know it was a far right extremist aka goyper who shot CK for not being far enough to the right?
Oh that's right all you snivelling right wing lunatics crawled back under your rocks.
You guys need to stop spreading this bullshit. It was a young guy from a normal, good family who was radicalised by the far left. He was not far right or even middle.
You’re lying through your teeth to try and take responsibility off people exactly like yourself.
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I'm going to challenge you all, right here, right now. Put down the thought of what's right, what's wrong, how people should be reacting, ect. I'm an apathetic bastard and I really could care less either way.
What I have noticed though is there's a LOT of divide on this one, more than usual. Lemmy's pretty homogenous but go outside to Facebook, Instagram, reddit, any of the mainstream places, hell, even talking about it with friends or family, you get some really differing views and people seem ready to discard longtime relationships over it. Hell, I've seen it happen 3 times now so far.
°So what do you think, take off the politics hat for a second and put on the sociology hat. Take a breath, and examine your surroundings.
°How does what's going on make you feel, sad? Angry? Scared, tired or relieved?
°What do you think this says about which direction our society is going, have you got any predictions? Any old timers who have been through near societal collapses before want to throw in their perspective?
I'm genuinely interested in what you all think
Obviously the ideal amount of political violence should be zero. If any other option exists, I think those must be taken first.
But sometimes the status quo is violence, and letting the status quo continue doing violence will overtime do more harm than one act of political violence. So mathematically, there must be some point where some violence is worth the cost of less harm in the future.
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I'm going to challenge you all, right here, right now. Put down the thought of what's right, what's wrong, how people should be reacting, ect. I'm an apathetic bastard and I really could care less either way.
What I have noticed though is there's a LOT of divide on this one, more than usual. Lemmy's pretty homogenous but go outside to Facebook, Instagram, reddit, any of the mainstream places, hell, even talking about it with friends or family, you get some really differing views and people seem ready to discard longtime relationships over it. Hell, I've seen it happen 3 times now so far.
°So what do you think, take off the politics hat for a second and put on the sociology hat. Take a breath, and examine your surroundings.
°How does what's going on make you feel, sad? Angry? Scared, tired or relieved?
°What do you think this says about which direction our society is going, have you got any predictions? Any old timers who have been through near societal collapses before want to throw in their perspective?
I'm genuinely interested in what you all think
I might have felt sympathy, but I'm too busy caring for people that he himself hurt. They deserve my attention more.
You don't run over a crowd of people, crash your car, and then get to lament that there are people in front of you at the emergency room.
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Since when are radicalized far left antifa supporters “republicans”?
You poor poor summer child who said he is far left? You don't have to be a person on the left to hate fascist. In America we had a tradition of killing fascist it didn't matter what side you were on, but I guess you forgot that.
The little groyper killed another republican. You are eating your own while we stare at you shaking our head. Oh well.
Republicans on Republican crime is interesting to watch. Let me know when a "lefty" kills another "lefty".
Lol.
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The shooter is confirmed to be “far left”, quit the bullshit.
God damn. You're insufferable.
