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  3. Terrified that peace might break out: Have European leaders completely lost their minds?

Terrified that peace might break out: Have European leaders completely lost their minds?

Scheduled Pinned Locked Moved Europe
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  • mee@reddthat.comM This user is from outside of this forum
    mee@reddthat.comM This user is from outside of this forum
    [email protected]
    wrote on last edited by
    #1

    Key Takeaways

    • “Imaginary American voter syndrome”: European leaders often perceive global politics as if they are American voters, failing to engage with geopolitical realities beyond U.S. domestic politics.
    • The war in Ukraine is increasingly recognised as a proxy war between U.S./NATO and Russia, e.g., by the U.S. Secretary of State. While initially denying any role in provoking the conflict, U.S. officials now tacitly admit NATO’s involvement in the war’s origins. European leadership struggles to adjust its narrative.
    • Failed strategy of Russia’s “strategic defeat”: European rhetoric about defeating Russia has not materialised, with a nuclear escalation becoming a growing risk.
    • Despite prolonged conflict, negotiations are returning to the same security concerns Russia raised in 2021, highlighting years of unnecessary devastation and death.
    • Macron’s nuclear remarks: The French president proposed sharing nuclear deterrents within Europe and only stopped short of declaring war on the Russian Federation.
    • Poland is pushing for nuclear access and mass military training, while Britain and others discuss direct military intervention in Ukraine—though only with U.S. backing, which has already been denied.
    • Diplomatic paralysis: European leaders refuse diplomatic engagement with Russia, branding negotiations as pro-Putin while advocating for continued war.
    • Military reality check: The Ukraine war’s scale has surpassed Europe’s military preparedness, with casualty numbers exceeding the EU’s combined active-duty personnel.
    • Increased military spending and mobilisation efforts drain resources, with arms manufacturers potentially influencing European political decisions.
    • At a time when the U.S. and Russia negotiate for peace, Europe’s warmongering stance (including the UNSC abstentions by France and the UK to a normative peace resolution backed by the U.S., China, and Russia among permanent UNSC members) is difficult to explain, but this makes it neither excusable nor less dangerous. A spirit of mass delusion proliferates.
    toothbrush@lemmy.blahaj.zoneT T 486@lemmy.world4 G T 8 Replies Last reply
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    • System shared this topic on
    • mee@reddthat.comM [email protected]

      Key Takeaways

      • “Imaginary American voter syndrome”: European leaders often perceive global politics as if they are American voters, failing to engage with geopolitical realities beyond U.S. domestic politics.
      • The war in Ukraine is increasingly recognised as a proxy war between U.S./NATO and Russia, e.g., by the U.S. Secretary of State. While initially denying any role in provoking the conflict, U.S. officials now tacitly admit NATO’s involvement in the war’s origins. European leadership struggles to adjust its narrative.
      • Failed strategy of Russia’s “strategic defeat”: European rhetoric about defeating Russia has not materialised, with a nuclear escalation becoming a growing risk.
      • Despite prolonged conflict, negotiations are returning to the same security concerns Russia raised in 2021, highlighting years of unnecessary devastation and death.
      • Macron’s nuclear remarks: The French president proposed sharing nuclear deterrents within Europe and only stopped short of declaring war on the Russian Federation.
      • Poland is pushing for nuclear access and mass military training, while Britain and others discuss direct military intervention in Ukraine—though only with U.S. backing, which has already been denied.
      • Diplomatic paralysis: European leaders refuse diplomatic engagement with Russia, branding negotiations as pro-Putin while advocating for continued war.
      • Military reality check: The Ukraine war’s scale has surpassed Europe’s military preparedness, with casualty numbers exceeding the EU’s combined active-duty personnel.
      • Increased military spending and mobilisation efforts drain resources, with arms manufacturers potentially influencing European political decisions.
      • At a time when the U.S. and Russia negotiate for peace, Europe’s warmongering stance (including the UNSC abstentions by France and the UK to a normative peace resolution backed by the U.S., China, and Russia among permanent UNSC members) is difficult to explain, but this makes it neither excusable nor less dangerous. A spirit of mass delusion proliferates.
      toothbrush@lemmy.blahaj.zoneT This user is from outside of this forum
      toothbrush@lemmy.blahaj.zoneT This user is from outside of this forum
      [email protected]
      wrote on last edited by
      #2

      "Europes warmongering stance"
      This article regurgitates russian propaganda.

      1 Reply Last reply
      0
      • mee@reddthat.comM [email protected]

        Key Takeaways

        • “Imaginary American voter syndrome”: European leaders often perceive global politics as if they are American voters, failing to engage with geopolitical realities beyond U.S. domestic politics.
        • The war in Ukraine is increasingly recognised as a proxy war between U.S./NATO and Russia, e.g., by the U.S. Secretary of State. While initially denying any role in provoking the conflict, U.S. officials now tacitly admit NATO’s involvement in the war’s origins. European leadership struggles to adjust its narrative.
        • Failed strategy of Russia’s “strategic defeat”: European rhetoric about defeating Russia has not materialised, with a nuclear escalation becoming a growing risk.
        • Despite prolonged conflict, negotiations are returning to the same security concerns Russia raised in 2021, highlighting years of unnecessary devastation and death.
        • Macron’s nuclear remarks: The French president proposed sharing nuclear deterrents within Europe and only stopped short of declaring war on the Russian Federation.
        • Poland is pushing for nuclear access and mass military training, while Britain and others discuss direct military intervention in Ukraine—though only with U.S. backing, which has already been denied.
        • Diplomatic paralysis: European leaders refuse diplomatic engagement with Russia, branding negotiations as pro-Putin while advocating for continued war.
        • Military reality check: The Ukraine war’s scale has surpassed Europe’s military preparedness, with casualty numbers exceeding the EU’s combined active-duty personnel.
        • Increased military spending and mobilisation efforts drain resources, with arms manufacturers potentially influencing European political decisions.
        • At a time when the U.S. and Russia negotiate for peace, Europe’s warmongering stance (including the UNSC abstentions by France and the UK to a normative peace resolution backed by the U.S., China, and Russia among permanent UNSC members) is difficult to explain, but this makes it neither excusable nor less dangerous. A spirit of mass delusion proliferates.
        T This user is from outside of this forum
        T This user is from outside of this forum
        [email protected]
        wrote on last edited by
        #3

        Was surprised to see this article wasn’t written by Sergey Lavrov himself. It might as well have been.

        1 Reply Last reply
        0
        • mee@reddthat.comM [email protected]

          Key Takeaways

          • “Imaginary American voter syndrome”: European leaders often perceive global politics as if they are American voters, failing to engage with geopolitical realities beyond U.S. domestic politics.
          • The war in Ukraine is increasingly recognised as a proxy war between U.S./NATO and Russia, e.g., by the U.S. Secretary of State. While initially denying any role in provoking the conflict, U.S. officials now tacitly admit NATO’s involvement in the war’s origins. European leadership struggles to adjust its narrative.
          • Failed strategy of Russia’s “strategic defeat”: European rhetoric about defeating Russia has not materialised, with a nuclear escalation becoming a growing risk.
          • Despite prolonged conflict, negotiations are returning to the same security concerns Russia raised in 2021, highlighting years of unnecessary devastation and death.
          • Macron’s nuclear remarks: The French president proposed sharing nuclear deterrents within Europe and only stopped short of declaring war on the Russian Federation.
          • Poland is pushing for nuclear access and mass military training, while Britain and others discuss direct military intervention in Ukraine—though only with U.S. backing, which has already been denied.
          • Diplomatic paralysis: European leaders refuse diplomatic engagement with Russia, branding negotiations as pro-Putin while advocating for continued war.
          • Military reality check: The Ukraine war’s scale has surpassed Europe’s military preparedness, with casualty numbers exceeding the EU’s combined active-duty personnel.
          • Increased military spending and mobilisation efforts drain resources, with arms manufacturers potentially influencing European political decisions.
          • At a time when the U.S. and Russia negotiate for peace, Europe’s warmongering stance (including the UNSC abstentions by France and the UK to a normative peace resolution backed by the U.S., China, and Russia among permanent UNSC members) is difficult to explain, but this makes it neither excusable nor less dangerous. A spirit of mass delusion proliferates.
          486@lemmy.world4 This user is from outside of this forum
          486@lemmy.world4 This user is from outside of this forum
          [email protected]
          wrote on last edited by
          #4

          What a heap of crap.

          1 Reply Last reply
          0
          • mee@reddthat.comM [email protected]

            Key Takeaways

            • “Imaginary American voter syndrome”: European leaders often perceive global politics as if they are American voters, failing to engage with geopolitical realities beyond U.S. domestic politics.
            • The war in Ukraine is increasingly recognised as a proxy war between U.S./NATO and Russia, e.g., by the U.S. Secretary of State. While initially denying any role in provoking the conflict, U.S. officials now tacitly admit NATO’s involvement in the war’s origins. European leadership struggles to adjust its narrative.
            • Failed strategy of Russia’s “strategic defeat”: European rhetoric about defeating Russia has not materialised, with a nuclear escalation becoming a growing risk.
            • Despite prolonged conflict, negotiations are returning to the same security concerns Russia raised in 2021, highlighting years of unnecessary devastation and death.
            • Macron’s nuclear remarks: The French president proposed sharing nuclear deterrents within Europe and only stopped short of declaring war on the Russian Federation.
            • Poland is pushing for nuclear access and mass military training, while Britain and others discuss direct military intervention in Ukraine—though only with U.S. backing, which has already been denied.
            • Diplomatic paralysis: European leaders refuse diplomatic engagement with Russia, branding negotiations as pro-Putin while advocating for continued war.
            • Military reality check: The Ukraine war’s scale has surpassed Europe’s military preparedness, with casualty numbers exceeding the EU’s combined active-duty personnel.
            • Increased military spending and mobilisation efforts drain resources, with arms manufacturers potentially influencing European political decisions.
            • At a time when the U.S. and Russia negotiate for peace, Europe’s warmongering stance (including the UNSC abstentions by France and the UK to a normative peace resolution backed by the U.S., China, and Russia among permanent UNSC members) is difficult to explain, but this makes it neither excusable nor less dangerous. A spirit of mass delusion proliferates.
            G This user is from outside of this forum
            G This user is from outside of this forum
            [email protected]
            wrote on last edited by
            #5

            Absolutely ridiculous. You mixed up feddit.org with lemmy.ml

            mee@reddthat.comM 1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • G [email protected]

              Absolutely ridiculous. You mixed up feddit.org with lemmy.ml

              mee@reddthat.comM This user is from outside of this forum
              mee@reddthat.comM This user is from outside of this forum
              [email protected]
              wrote on last edited by
              #6

              Feddit(.)ml at any moment now.

              1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • mee@reddthat.comM [email protected]

                Key Takeaways

                • “Imaginary American voter syndrome”: European leaders often perceive global politics as if they are American voters, failing to engage with geopolitical realities beyond U.S. domestic politics.
                • The war in Ukraine is increasingly recognised as a proxy war between U.S./NATO and Russia, e.g., by the U.S. Secretary of State. While initially denying any role in provoking the conflict, U.S. officials now tacitly admit NATO’s involvement in the war’s origins. European leadership struggles to adjust its narrative.
                • Failed strategy of Russia’s “strategic defeat”: European rhetoric about defeating Russia has not materialised, with a nuclear escalation becoming a growing risk.
                • Despite prolonged conflict, negotiations are returning to the same security concerns Russia raised in 2021, highlighting years of unnecessary devastation and death.
                • Macron’s nuclear remarks: The French president proposed sharing nuclear deterrents within Europe and only stopped short of declaring war on the Russian Federation.
                • Poland is pushing for nuclear access and mass military training, while Britain and others discuss direct military intervention in Ukraine—though only with U.S. backing, which has already been denied.
                • Diplomatic paralysis: European leaders refuse diplomatic engagement with Russia, branding negotiations as pro-Putin while advocating for continued war.
                • Military reality check: The Ukraine war’s scale has surpassed Europe’s military preparedness, with casualty numbers exceeding the EU’s combined active-duty personnel.
                • Increased military spending and mobilisation efforts drain resources, with arms manufacturers potentially influencing European political decisions.
                • At a time when the U.S. and Russia negotiate for peace, Europe’s warmongering stance (including the UNSC abstentions by France and the UK to a normative peace resolution backed by the U.S., China, and Russia among permanent UNSC members) is difficult to explain, but this makes it neither excusable nor less dangerous. A spirit of mass delusion proliferates.
                T This user is from outside of this forum
                T This user is from outside of this forum
                [email protected]
                wrote on last edited by
                #7

                Lmao "us and russia negotiate for peace" installing a piss-soaked puppet who bends over on command is not a negotiation

                1 Reply Last reply
                0
                • mee@reddthat.comM [email protected]

                  Key Takeaways

                  • “Imaginary American voter syndrome”: European leaders often perceive global politics as if they are American voters, failing to engage with geopolitical realities beyond U.S. domestic politics.
                  • The war in Ukraine is increasingly recognised as a proxy war between U.S./NATO and Russia, e.g., by the U.S. Secretary of State. While initially denying any role in provoking the conflict, U.S. officials now tacitly admit NATO’s involvement in the war’s origins. European leadership struggles to adjust its narrative.
                  • Failed strategy of Russia’s “strategic defeat”: European rhetoric about defeating Russia has not materialised, with a nuclear escalation becoming a growing risk.
                  • Despite prolonged conflict, negotiations are returning to the same security concerns Russia raised in 2021, highlighting years of unnecessary devastation and death.
                  • Macron’s nuclear remarks: The French president proposed sharing nuclear deterrents within Europe and only stopped short of declaring war on the Russian Federation.
                  • Poland is pushing for nuclear access and mass military training, while Britain and others discuss direct military intervention in Ukraine—though only with U.S. backing, which has already been denied.
                  • Diplomatic paralysis: European leaders refuse diplomatic engagement with Russia, branding negotiations as pro-Putin while advocating for continued war.
                  • Military reality check: The Ukraine war’s scale has surpassed Europe’s military preparedness, with casualty numbers exceeding the EU’s combined active-duty personnel.
                  • Increased military spending and mobilisation efforts drain resources, with arms manufacturers potentially influencing European political decisions.
                  • At a time when the U.S. and Russia negotiate for peace, Europe’s warmongering stance (including the UNSC abstentions by France and the UK to a normative peace resolution backed by the U.S., China, and Russia among permanent UNSC members) is difficult to explain, but this makes it neither excusable nor less dangerous. A spirit of mass delusion proliferates.
                  A This user is from outside of this forum
                  A This user is from outside of this forum
                  [email protected]
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #8

                  Europe's strategy seems to be little more than "keep supporting Ukraine and hope the Russians get bored or their economy completely collapses".

                  My opinion is the same as it was in 2022, I think we're vastly underestimating Russia's resilience and ability to continue the war. Wouldn't surprise me if it outlasts European citizens' tolerance for footing the bill. For all the money and equipment we've sent, the Russians have barely moved an inch from the territory they control. Trying to bleed them dry just hasn't worked.

                  1 Reply Last reply
                  0
                  • mee@reddthat.comM [email protected]

                    Key Takeaways

                    • “Imaginary American voter syndrome”: European leaders often perceive global politics as if they are American voters, failing to engage with geopolitical realities beyond U.S. domestic politics.
                    • The war in Ukraine is increasingly recognised as a proxy war between U.S./NATO and Russia, e.g., by the U.S. Secretary of State. While initially denying any role in provoking the conflict, U.S. officials now tacitly admit NATO’s involvement in the war’s origins. European leadership struggles to adjust its narrative.
                    • Failed strategy of Russia’s “strategic defeat”: European rhetoric about defeating Russia has not materialised, with a nuclear escalation becoming a growing risk.
                    • Despite prolonged conflict, negotiations are returning to the same security concerns Russia raised in 2021, highlighting years of unnecessary devastation and death.
                    • Macron’s nuclear remarks: The French president proposed sharing nuclear deterrents within Europe and only stopped short of declaring war on the Russian Federation.
                    • Poland is pushing for nuclear access and mass military training, while Britain and others discuss direct military intervention in Ukraine—though only with U.S. backing, which has already been denied.
                    • Diplomatic paralysis: European leaders refuse diplomatic engagement with Russia, branding negotiations as pro-Putin while advocating for continued war.
                    • Military reality check: The Ukraine war’s scale has surpassed Europe’s military preparedness, with casualty numbers exceeding the EU’s combined active-duty personnel.
                    • Increased military spending and mobilisation efforts drain resources, with arms manufacturers potentially influencing European political decisions.
                    • At a time when the U.S. and Russia negotiate for peace, Europe’s warmongering stance (including the UNSC abstentions by France and the UK to a normative peace resolution backed by the U.S., China, and Russia among permanent UNSC members) is difficult to explain, but this makes it neither excusable nor less dangerous. A spirit of mass delusion proliferates.
                    ? Offline
                    ? Offline
                    Guest
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #9

                    Reading a lot of russian propaganda, are we?

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • mee@reddthat.comM [email protected]

                      Key Takeaways

                      • “Imaginary American voter syndrome”: European leaders often perceive global politics as if they are American voters, failing to engage with geopolitical realities beyond U.S. domestic politics.
                      • The war in Ukraine is increasingly recognised as a proxy war between U.S./NATO and Russia, e.g., by the U.S. Secretary of State. While initially denying any role in provoking the conflict, U.S. officials now tacitly admit NATO’s involvement in the war’s origins. European leadership struggles to adjust its narrative.
                      • Failed strategy of Russia’s “strategic defeat”: European rhetoric about defeating Russia has not materialised, with a nuclear escalation becoming a growing risk.
                      • Despite prolonged conflict, negotiations are returning to the same security concerns Russia raised in 2021, highlighting years of unnecessary devastation and death.
                      • Macron’s nuclear remarks: The French president proposed sharing nuclear deterrents within Europe and only stopped short of declaring war on the Russian Federation.
                      • Poland is pushing for nuclear access and mass military training, while Britain and others discuss direct military intervention in Ukraine—though only with U.S. backing, which has already been denied.
                      • Diplomatic paralysis: European leaders refuse diplomatic engagement with Russia, branding negotiations as pro-Putin while advocating for continued war.
                      • Military reality check: The Ukraine war’s scale has surpassed Europe’s military preparedness, with casualty numbers exceeding the EU’s combined active-duty personnel.
                      • Increased military spending and mobilisation efforts drain resources, with arms manufacturers potentially influencing European political decisions.
                      • At a time when the U.S. and Russia negotiate for peace, Europe’s warmongering stance (including the UNSC abstentions by France and the UK to a normative peace resolution backed by the U.S., China, and Russia among permanent UNSC members) is difficult to explain, but this makes it neither excusable nor less dangerous. A spirit of mass delusion proliferates.
                      S This user is from outside of this forum
                      S This user is from outside of this forum
                      [email protected]
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #10

                      Suspicious website looks suspicious

                      mee@reddthat.comM 1 Reply Last reply
                      0
                      • S [email protected]

                        Suspicious website looks suspicious

                        mee@reddthat.comM This user is from outside of this forum
                        mee@reddthat.comM This user is from outside of this forum
                        [email protected]
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #11

                        I found out about this article from ZNetwork: https://znetwork.org/znetarticle/terrified-that-peace-might-break-out-have-european-leaders-completely-lost-their-minds/

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