German army struggles to get Gen Z recruits ‘ready for war’
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cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/27232360
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cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/27232360
In a book published this week, Why I Would Never Fight for My Country, the 27-year-old argues ordinary people should not be sent into battle on behalf of nation states and their rulers — even to fend off an invasion. Occupation by a foreign power might lead to a “shitty” life, he told the Financial Times. “But I’d rather be occupied than dead.”
Is he familiar with occupied Palestine?
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cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/27232360
But I’d rather be occupied than dead.
Tell that to the Ukrainian men who are forced into service by Russia to act as cannon fodder.Do the words "vae victis" mean anything to him? Occupation could literally mean ethnic cleansing. The fact that that guy graduated from university is shameful.
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cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/27232360
Military service is a hard concept to grasp when you're sitting comfy at home, not a care in the world and all the conflicts are "over there".
It's a very different story when there is an existential threat looming over your head, weighing on your shoulders like a mountain. Canada's armed forces is already meeting its yearly recruitment targets due to repeated threats of invasion from the United States.
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In a book published this week, Why I Would Never Fight for My Country, the 27-year-old argues ordinary people should not be sent into battle on behalf of nation states and their rulers — even to fend off an invasion. Occupation by a foreign power might lead to a “shitty” life, he told the Financial Times. “But I’d rather be occupied than dead.”
Is he familiar with occupied Palestine?
I mean, even if it doesn't go towards genocide, have they considered the new power's probable policy on military service? They have to have a chapter on that, right?
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cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/27232360
But one senior army commander said members of Generation Z — renowned in the business world for their efforts to reshape corporate culture — were also going into the armed forces with different ideas and outlooks. “People are vulnerable, they cry easily,” he said. “They talk about work-life balance.”
“I understand that,” the commander added. “They grew up in a different time. It’s not a bad perspective. But it doesn’t match that well with a wartime situation.”
Work-life balance obviously goes out the window in a war (actually, life itself does). Does being vulnerable really preclude you from being brave, though?
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But one senior army commander said members of Generation Z — renowned in the business world for their efforts to reshape corporate culture — were also going into the armed forces with different ideas and outlooks. “People are vulnerable, they cry easily,” he said. “They talk about work-life balance.”
“I understand that,” the commander added. “They grew up in a different time. It’s not a bad perspective. But it doesn’t match that well with a wartime situation.”
Work-life balance obviously goes out the window in a war (actually, life itself does). Does being vulnerable really preclude you from being brave, though?
Vulnerability not, but sympathy misunderstood for empathy will. I don't think German Gen Z doesn't enlist because of vulnerability, but because of culture. German liberal nationalism relies on 'Never again' as a mantra of nonaggression; to them the Bundeswehr was always a compromise against the NVA.
Schools until recently told us that conventional war is 'fallen out of time', "look at UN, EU, OSCE".
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Vulnerability not, but sympathy misunderstood for empathy will. I don't think German Gen Z doesn't enlist because of vulnerability, but because of culture. German liberal nationalism relies on 'Never again' as a mantra of nonaggression; to them the Bundeswehr was always a compromise against the NVA.
Schools until recently told us that conventional war is 'fallen out of time', "look at UN, EU, OSCE".
Schools until recently told us that conventional war is ‘fallen out of time’, “look at UN, EU, OSCE”.
Wow, that's been the attitude here too, but you never hear people say it outright.
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the dude with that photo… i never seen someone so out of touch, a 27 year old boomer
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Vulnerability not, but sympathy misunderstood for empathy will. I don't think German Gen Z doesn't enlist because of vulnerability, but because of culture. German liberal nationalism relies on 'Never again' as a mantra of nonaggression; to them the Bundeswehr was always a compromise against the NVA.
Schools until recently told us that conventional war is 'fallen out of time', "look at UN, EU, OSCE".
German liberal nationalism is a sham for different reasons, but also neoliberalism destroyed the economic social contract.
Why should i die, so old people can sit in their large houses unaffordable to me, despite my better qualification, while they also destroy the environment and proudly fuel climate change with their big cars and cruise travels? Of course there is also plenty of old people who barely get by. But those dont demand the young people to sacrifice themselves in the reactionary "liberal" media.
At the same time Germany does have access to higher education without going through the military if you aren't affluent. So forcing the poor into the military as the only option to escape poverty is not as severe like in the US.
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cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/27232360
Good luck trying that here. All kids are fat asses.
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cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/27232360
Can't blame anyone for not wanting to risk their lhealth or even lives. More and more people doing that is probably a good thing in general. Brings everyone closer to making the old adage "imagine there's war and nobody comes" a reality.
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Schools until recently told us that conventional war is ‘fallen out of time’, “look at UN, EU, OSCE”.
Wow, that's been the attitude here too, but you never hear people say it outright.
It was true. It was the longest continuous peace in Europe ever.
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Can't blame anyone for not wanting to risk their lhealth or even lives. More and more people doing that is probably a good thing in general. Brings everyone closer to making the old adage "imagine there's war and nobody comes" a reality.
It can only be a good thing if the enemy shares the same values, which is not the case with Russia.
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cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/27232360
Why be ready to fight and possibly kill or die for a country that is less and less worth it everyday?
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cross-posted from: https://lemmy.ml/post/27232360
I’m a millennial who was happy to not be required to go through military training back when it was still a thing but already phasing out. Bundeswehr was a thing for gun fanatics and manly men, nothing that was actually necessary. I was a pacifist. My work values today are now close to what Gen Z apparently has. Work is simply not the center of my life anymore.
These days I’m wondering if a 40 year old man (in better shape than my 18 year old self though) can still enlist voluntarily because I want to fight for our European values. I’d rather die in battle than being occupied by power hungry dictators.
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Schools until recently told us that conventional war is ‘fallen out of time’, “look at UN, EU, OSCE”.
Wow, that's been the attitude here too, but you never hear people say it outright.
Yeah that's why current events hit people twice as hard. We basically all assumed peace to be a given. It's not.
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Vulnerability not, but sympathy misunderstood for empathy will. I don't think German Gen Z doesn't enlist because of vulnerability, but because of culture. German liberal nationalism relies on 'Never again' as a mantra of nonaggression; to them the Bundeswehr was always a compromise against the NVA.
Schools until recently told us that conventional war is 'fallen out of time', "look at UN, EU, OSCE".
As a German Gen Z my main concern would be the fact that you can't rely on the promise that our army is purely there for defence. I'm ready to defend my home and the home of my neighbors but I'm not willing to be sent to another continent to do so. Right now that may not be an issue but these things can change overnight.
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As a German Gen Z my main concern would be the fact that you can't rely on the promise that our army is purely there for defence. I'm ready to defend my home and the home of my neighbors but I'm not willing to be sent to another continent to do so. Right now that may not be an issue but these things can change overnight.
Last year I was seriously considering having myself examined for those new-ish territorial defense units in the reserve.
With the theoretical possibility of an AgD/CxU government the risk of having to guard some camps instead of critical infrastructure has become greater than 0, therefore I will wait for at least six months to see how Fritz von Papen fares.
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I’m a millennial who was happy to not be required to go through military training back when it was still a thing but already phasing out. Bundeswehr was a thing for gun fanatics and manly men, nothing that was actually necessary. I was a pacifist. My work values today are now close to what Gen Z apparently has. Work is simply not the center of my life anymore.
These days I’m wondering if a 40 year old man (in better shape than my 18 year old self though) can still enlist voluntarily because I want to fight for our European values. I’d rather die in battle than being occupied by power hungry dictators.
I am also a millenial, a woman. And I agree with you. Rather fight for liberty than in a dictatorship. I‘ve already lived in a dictatorship the first years of my life, and although a kid, I do remember what was like and my parent did explain to us that there are other things outside the bubble, that there is freedom outside. We were told not to talk about it outside of the family, of course, because of security police.
I like the system that the Swiss have, to have all your population trained. To also know how to handle guns and be working in a team snd whatever they do to train. And they get refreshers every year according to Le Chat: Yes, Swiss citizens who have completed their basic military training are required to participate in annual refresher courses. Specifically, after finishing basic training, individuals remain members of the Armed Forces for nine years and must complete six refresher courses, each lasting three weeks, during this period. These courses ensure that their military skills remain up-to-date and that they are prepared for any potential service requirements. The obligation to serve in the military or alternative civilian service typically applies from age 18 to 30 .„
I would not enter in that age requirement anymore, but I would still love to do it. It is never a bad idea to be prepared, even if you don’t have to use your skills. Also to learn how to sabotage possible invaders, I think it would be invaluable in case of war. Look at Ukraine when they were invaded. There are a lot of stories of normal people fighting greatly against the surprise invasion.
And a war nowadays would look different than what was in WW2. I am far from being an expert, I am none, but the military equipment modern Europe has, is different even of what they sent to Ukraine. I think they sent a lot of old stuff. And having fighter jets and stuff like that, would be more helpful for the fight.
I read the other day someone from Finland, I think, saying that their goal this year is to learn to fly drones, so he could help in case of Russian attack. Fighting for Europe does not mean always being on the frontline with a gun in your hands.
