You must be good at Math
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Lambda calculus has no relation to calculus calculus
I wanna fight your math teachers. No seriously, what did they tell you calculus is if it's got nothing in common with lambda calculus?
wrote last edited by [email protected]Is there some connection I've just been missing? It's a pretty straight rewriting system, it seems Newton wouldn't have had much use for it.
Lot's of things get called "calculus". Originally, calculus calculus was "the infinitesimal calculus" IIRC.
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Is there some connection I've just been missing? It's a pretty straight rewriting system, it seems Newton wouldn't have had much use for it.
Lot's of things get called "calculus". Originally, calculus calculus was "the infinitesimal calculus" IIRC.
wrote last edited by [email protected]I think the issue here might be the overloading of terms - lambda calculus is both the system of notation and the common name for the conceptual underpinnings of computational theory. While there is little to no similarity between the abstracted study of change over a domain and a notational system, the idea of function composition or continuous function theory (or even just computation as a concept) are all closely related with basic concepts from "calculus calculus" like limit theory and integral progression.
edit: clarity
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Wait til you see XNAND
My favorite was always XANEX
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What kind of cs degree did you get where you learned about electrical circuits. The closest to hardware I've learned is logic circuit diagrams and verilog.
wrote last edited by [email protected]In my own uni's coursework the closest we get are some labs where students breadboard some simple adder circuits, which we do just to save them from embarassing gaps in their knowledge (like happened in the inital comment). It doesn't add much beyond a slightly better understanding of how things can be implemented, if we're being honest.
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Informatics is a much better name imo
I see there's a fellow German speaker
I do agree though!
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What kind of cs degree did you get where you learned about electrical circuits. The closest to hardware I've learned is logic circuit diagrams and verilog.
I mean, I graduated over 20 years ago now, but I had to take a number of EE courses for my CS major. Guess that isn't a thing now, or in a lot of places? Just assumed some level of EE knowledge was required for a CS degree this whole time.
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I mean, I graduated over 20 years ago now, but I had to take a number of EE courses for my CS major. Guess that isn't a thing now, or in a lot of places? Just assumed some level of EE knowledge was required for a CS degree this whole time.
I got my BS in CSci about 15 years ago and it was 100% about programming in java. We didn't learn a fucking thing about hardware and my roommate was an EE major and we had none of the same classes except for calculus.
By the time I graduated java was basically dead. Thanks state college.
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My favorite was always XANEX
what fuck that one does
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what fuck that one does
wrote last edited by [email protected]Turns all your zeros into ones.
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I think the issue here might be the overloading of terms - lambda calculus is both the system of notation and the common name for the conceptual underpinnings of computational theory. While there is little to no similarity between the abstracted study of change over a domain and a notational system, the idea of function composition or continuous function theory (or even just computation as a concept) are all closely related with basic concepts from "calculus calculus" like limit theory and integral progression.
edit: clarity
I'm pretty sure the term was coined in the interwar era, so it's kind of interesting if people are just calling the concept of functions "lambda calculus" now. Obviously they're much older than that.
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I'm pretty sure the term was coined in the interwar era, so it's kind of interesting if people are just calling the concept of functions "lambda calculus" now. Obviously they're much older than that.
wrote last edited by [email protected]What? Nobody's doing that, it's just a distinct area of mathematics - I'm pretty confused where you got that idea from at all.
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What? Nobody's doing that, it's just a distinct area of mathematics - I'm pretty confused where you got that idea from at all.
So, I took it from these parts together:
and the common name for the conceptual underpinnings of computational theory.
the idea of function composition or continuous function theory (or even just computation as a concept) are all closely related with basic concepts from “calculus calculus” like limit theory and integral progression.
I'm still not seeing the connection otherwise.
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So, I took it from these parts together:
and the common name for the conceptual underpinnings of computational theory.
the idea of function composition or continuous function theory (or even just computation as a concept) are all closely related with basic concepts from “calculus calculus” like limit theory and integral progression.
I'm still not seeing the connection otherwise.
wrote last edited by [email protected]Okay, meta question here: What would a 'connection' that you're willing to accept actually look like? Those I've already presented are what I would call pretty explicit connections between the two fields (and fragmenting this into an explanation of how lambda calculus relies and expands on functional mechanics is going to be a loooong diversion). It's starting to feel like you're pretty entrenched in your initial position, and are just looking for an internet debate.
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I got my BS in CSci about 15 years ago and it was 100% about programming in java. We didn't learn a fucking thing about hardware and my roommate was an EE major and we had none of the same classes except for calculus.
By the time I graduated java was basically dead. Thanks state college.
Java isn't dead, though
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Okay, meta question here: What would a 'connection' that you're willing to accept actually look like? Those I've already presented are what I would call pretty explicit connections between the two fields (and fragmenting this into an explanation of how lambda calculus relies and expands on functional mechanics is going to be a loooong diversion). It's starting to feel like you're pretty entrenched in your initial position, and are just looking for an internet debate.
wrote last edited by [email protected]I wouldn't say entrenched, because I think this is honestly the first time I've seen the two come up together outside of their shared name. I was surprised, but then again sometimes reality is surprising.
Both have function composition, and expressions which contain free variables in multiple places. At the time, that was just a shorthand for what they were trying to express about slight changes. A bit later, formal analysis was axiomised, and is full of infinite things like Cauchy sequences and general topology. In the 20th century, substitution of a composed function into free variables becomes an object of study of it's own, and found to be able to produce full complexity without anything else being added, being Turing equivalent.
All the infinite and continuous stuff that makes calculus work, at least as it's considered abstractly, doesn't really translate into a discrete system. You can numerically approximate it, and I guess you could even use lambda calculus-like functional language to do that, but I'm not mad it never came up in my math courses, like in your original comment.
If there's nothing more to add to that, I am sorry for wasting your time.
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If you want to know how philosophy works, do sociology...
It's kind of like a horseshoe with philosophy and math at the ends.
wrote last edited by [email protected]If you want to no longer want to know how anything works, do biochemistry
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If you want to no longer want to know how anything works, do biochemistry
Too real
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I mean, I graduated over 20 years ago now, but I had to take a number of EE courses for my CS major. Guess that isn't a thing now, or in a lot of places? Just assumed some level of EE knowledge was required for a CS degree this whole time.
wrote last edited by [email protected]In my uni they kinda just teach java. There is one mandatory class that's in C and one that's in mips assembly tho.
Everyone used AI when I took those classes. By the end of the year they were still having trouble on groupchat with syntax stuff.
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Maybe for dev knowledge, but computer science? The science of computers?
Is that not the difference between a computer science and a computer engineering degree?
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Well, computer science is not the science of computers, is it? It's about using computers (in the sense of programming them), not about making computers. Making computers is electrical engineering.
We all know how great we IT people are at naming things
wrote last edited by [email protected]My BS in CS took its roots down to CMOS composition of logic gates and basic EE, on the hardware side, and down to deriving numbers and arithmetic from Boolean logic / predicate calculus, on the philosophy side. Then tied those up together through the theoretical underpinnings of computation and problem solving, like a trunk, and branched back out into the various mainstream technologies that derived from all that. It obviously all depends on the program at the school of choice, I suppose, and I'm sure it's evolved over the years, but it still seems important to have at least some courses that pull back the wizard's curtain to ensure their students really see how it's all just an increasingly elaborate, high-tech version of conceptually simple (in function) machinery carrying out fundamental building blocks of logic.
Anyway, I'm going to go sniff my own cinnamon roll scented farts while gazing in the mirror, now.
