Lemmings who have personal experience with bipolar disorder (self, family, or friends), how hopeless is the situation, really?
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Thanks for your response. We will ask about generic testing.
You're welcome. The company my psychiatrist used to do it is called GeneSight if that helps at all.
Be careful though, they have a lot of negative reviews about people's doctors saying it is covered and then getting a bill for services. I did not have that experience, mine was definitely fully covered and I have not received a bill. Check with your insurance to be sure, and if you're open to paying it out of pocket, it sounds like $300 to $500 is about the cost most people pay when insurance doesn't cover it.
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My son has been diagnosed with bipolar disorder. He's in his mid-twenties, so it's the average time for onset of bipolar disorder. No family history that we know of, but if it was just two generations back, it probably wouldn't have been talked about.
He had his first manic episode early in the year. He spent a brief time in in-patient treatment, followed by a period of out-patient treatment. During the out-patient treatment, his psychiatrist started to think the diagnosis was incorrect and she weaned him off his meds.
He has had another manic episode, and he's back in the in-patient facility. Luckily he was able to get back into the same place he was in before, so they aren't starting from zero. They started him back on different meds, and he's much better much faster than the first time.
His fiancee was talking to a friend and someone overheard. The person who overheard said her mother was bipolar and she had to take her to the hospital six times, and she told his fiancee that she should break up with him.
The only experts I've spoken to have been the doctors in the crisis center, and I don't know to what degree they are trying to sugar coat things to prevent us from giving up hope.
I'd rather know the reality.
If anyone has any personal experience they can share, I'd appreciate it. If anyone has any professional experience they can share, I'd appreciate that as well.
EDIT: Just wanted to add to this that we were able to visit him today, and he's doing very well.
Hi, Bipolar NOS (“not otherwise specified”) here, more down than up. It’s absolutely possible to do great. Like your son, early 20s onset, spent some time inpatient to get sorted out, and have been in consistent outpatient therapy and psychiatry treatment ever since. Completed a PhD program, got married, job market sucks but I’m still optimistic all things considered. I think consistency in treatment, lots of patience, and a good psychiatrist who you can trust are key.
My spiel on the medication part, and some bipolar stigma: some people want to chase the mania, or get a little hypomania and think they’re doing better and don’t need the meds, or think the medication “stifles creativity,” and they give us a bad name. Think Kanye. For every up, there is a down. Not every up is good. The down is far worse. For me, it’s important to remember how bad things can get, because I don’t want that. Whatever side effects and months/years of tinkering with medications are worth it, to me, over losing my spouse, friends, family, or even my life.
Yes, the process of trying medications sucks, but it’s entirely necessary. Also have a good plan for if things get suddenly worse, because they absolutely can — a dud batch of mood stabilizers from when your pharmacy switches manufacturers, for example.
I could literally go on forever, but the tl;dr is that you can do great, just be prepared to put some time and effort into it. And never stop taking medications because you think/feel you’re doing better.
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Thanks for your response. We will ask about generic testing.
I want to second genetic testing! I had it done for myself after taking medicine for depression for years without it helping, and my doctor and I were able to find something that has helped me a lot.
I'm not sure if there's different companies that do it, but just so you have a name, the one I used was Genesight. I think my insurance told me that they wouldn't cover it, so I was able to get it for free.
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Thank you for your response. It is very helpful.
I've been hopeful because my son has shown that he wants treatment.
When he was weaned off his meds, we all latched onto the idea that the diagnosis was wrong, and I think we missed red flags because we didn't want to see them. I don't think we have to feel guilty about that, but we have now gone back to accepting the reality and we know we have to pay closer attention.
I do think that medication is key, and luckily my fiance is very dedicated to taking his pills diligently. If your son is seeking treatment, then that's a great step in the right direction. And with your support, I think he will definitely be on the right path. Best of luck! I'll be rooting for him and you
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My son has been diagnosed with bipolar disorder. He's in his mid-twenties, so it's the average time for onset of bipolar disorder. No family history that we know of, but if it was just two generations back, it probably wouldn't have been talked about.
He had his first manic episode early in the year. He spent a brief time in in-patient treatment, followed by a period of out-patient treatment. During the out-patient treatment, his psychiatrist started to think the diagnosis was incorrect and she weaned him off his meds.
He has had another manic episode, and he's back in the in-patient facility. Luckily he was able to get back into the same place he was in before, so they aren't starting from zero. They started him back on different meds, and he's much better much faster than the first time.
His fiancee was talking to a friend and someone overheard. The person who overheard said her mother was bipolar and she had to take her to the hospital six times, and she told his fiancee that she should break up with him.
The only experts I've spoken to have been the doctors in the crisis center, and I don't know to what degree they are trying to sugar coat things to prevent us from giving up hope.
I'd rather know the reality.
If anyone has any personal experience they can share, I'd appreciate it. If anyone has any professional experience they can share, I'd appreciate that as well.
EDIT: Just wanted to add to this that we were able to visit him today, and he's doing very well.
Diagnosed BIpolar 1, mostly depressive, but sometimes manic.
I am deathly afraid of the manic episodes that I've got some fear of "being too happy". I'd rather deal with the lows (even the lowest of the low) because at least with those, I can trust myself to lack the energy to be destructive. I am fairly confident that in my lowest, I won't even have the energy to commit suicide even if I want to.
Mania is a very different beast altogether. It might manifest on a spectrum from "just too wired up for sleep" to, in a couple of really badly unmanaged episodes, going off to an entirely different part of the country on a whim just because "who cares, I'm dying anyways?" Only through sheer luck did I manage to get home safe both times.
That said, honest self-awareness, honesty to the mental health professionals, and sticking to the treatment plan could make it manageable. It's no guarantee, but it helps.
It also helps to manage expectations: the treatment won't be on target especially on the first states, while the doctors adjust the medication and the dosage, deal with the side effects, etc. Some kind of faith in the process is necessary, I think--not blind trust, but trust that if you inform the doctors honestly any effects (side effects or not) to the best of your abilities, then the doctors can manage the condition better than if you think "I feel fine, the meds aren't needed anymore!"
The treatment--the management of the condition is likely to last until the very end, and that's fine.
About being in a relationship? It's really up to the person and their partner: I wouldn't trust myself to go on in a relationship without at least informing my partner about it--and keeping them up to date with "my mood weather report". However it probably takes experience, a few cycles to get used to it.
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There are multiple types of bipolar disorder with various features, so take any advice from strangers with a grain of salt, as they probably don't know the specifics. I have a couple of personal experiences with bipolar disorder in general.
First, a close friend of mine - his manic episodes would usually involve him staying awake for days at a time, and his depressive episodes were pretty bad. Before being diagnosed with bipolar disorder he had some pretty bad experiences with therapy from a "therapist" that clearly didn't know anything about depression or bipolar disorder, since being diagnosed and settling on a medication he has been much, much more stable. I used to lie awake unable to sleep from the stress of worrying about him, I don't anymore. He still has depressive and manic periods but they are much, much less severe.
Secondly, an aunt. She had one of the more severe types, but we didn't know it. She always had bad depressive episodes (and there was apparently an early bad episode of mania that was written off as a one-off mental episode from stress or something) but it wasn't until she suddenly left my uncle and their children to run off with a married man she barely knew that it became more apparent something else was wrong. I suggested - stressing that I am not an expert in the matter - that it kind of sounded a lot like some of the self-destructive manic episodes I had heard about, not from my friend but from Stephen Fry. I had heard him talk about his bipolar disorder at one of his shows in Sydney, and his past involved a lot more trouble than you'd expect. He has a couple of documentaries about it, but I can't speak on how helpful they would be. Anyway, I turned out to be right, and so far she seems to be doing better, but it's still early days.
The main takeaway is there is hope. One thing I took away from Stephen Fry's talks in particular was that it is vital to keep taking the medication and not to decide, after a period of stability, that you don't need it anymore, that's a recipe for disaster.
wrote on last edited by [email protected]jsyk, BPD stands for Borderline Personality Disorder, not bipolar disorder. I get them mixed up as well because BPD could reasonably stand for both.
The disorders can seem similar, which leads to more confusion, but they are pretty different in some aspects.
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jsyk, BPD stands for Borderline Personality Disorder, not bipolar disorder. I get them mixed up as well because BPD could reasonably stand for both.
The disorders can seem similar, which leads to more confusion, but they are pretty different in some aspects.
wrote on last edited by [email protected]Whoops, I knew that, but I typed this just after waking up. I'll edit that.
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Both times, at the height of the episode, he recognized that it wasn't right and asked for help.
While sitting in the crisis center with him and waiting for an out-patient placement this time, there was a moment when I was saying he just needed meds to get centered. He objected and said he was centered. I pointed out that if he was centered, we'd all be sleeping in our beds, and he was able to accept the logic of that.
The only reason he went off the meds the first time was because he was experiencing some bad side-effects and the doctor wasn't certain of the diagnosis. I'm pretty confident that he'll stay on the meds.
It's worth exploring different medications to see if there are less side effects, it took my friend a few tries to find one that was effective without intolerable side effects.
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It's worth exploring different medications to see if there are less side effects, it took my friend a few tries to find one that was effective without intolerable side effects.
Yeah, I spoke to him about that in the crisis center. I told him that it's going to take time and it's important to keep trying and to be aware of the possible side-effects so he can watch out for them.
When he told us that he started meds again, he told us what it was and let us know that he asked the doctor about side-effects, so I felt good about that.
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Hi, Bipolar NOS (“not otherwise specified”) here, more down than up. It’s absolutely possible to do great. Like your son, early 20s onset, spent some time inpatient to get sorted out, and have been in consistent outpatient therapy and psychiatry treatment ever since. Completed a PhD program, got married, job market sucks but I’m still optimistic all things considered. I think consistency in treatment, lots of patience, and a good psychiatrist who you can trust are key.
My spiel on the medication part, and some bipolar stigma: some people want to chase the mania, or get a little hypomania and think they’re doing better and don’t need the meds, or think the medication “stifles creativity,” and they give us a bad name. Think Kanye. For every up, there is a down. Not every up is good. The down is far worse. For me, it’s important to remember how bad things can get, because I don’t want that. Whatever side effects and months/years of tinkering with medications are worth it, to me, over losing my spouse, friends, family, or even my life.
Yes, the process of trying medications sucks, but it’s entirely necessary. Also have a good plan for if things get suddenly worse, because they absolutely can — a dud batch of mood stabilizers from when your pharmacy switches manufacturers, for example.
I could literally go on forever, but the tl;dr is that you can do great, just be prepared to put some time and effort into it. And never stop taking medications because you think/feel you’re doing better.
Thank you for sharing!
It's interesting that you mention Kanye, because the first time they mentioned bipolar in the crisis center, he said he had been thinking about Kanye.
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You're welcome. The company my psychiatrist used to do it is called GeneSight if that helps at all.
Be careful though, they have a lot of negative reviews about people's doctors saying it is covered and then getting a bill for services. I did not have that experience, mine was definitely fully covered and I have not received a bill. Check with your insurance to be sure, and if you're open to paying it out of pocket, it sounds like $300 to $500 is about the cost most people pay when insurance doesn't cover it.
Thanks again!
We'll definitely check them out. If the insurance doesn't cover it, we'll make it work.
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An important question; type 1 or 2? They're both difficult but type 1 tends to really wreck lives in a dramatic way.
We'll have to ask that. I don't think it's been said, although it's possible that it went past me without me understanding.
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Diagnosed BIpolar 1, mostly depressive, but sometimes manic.
I am deathly afraid of the manic episodes that I've got some fear of "being too happy". I'd rather deal with the lows (even the lowest of the low) because at least with those, I can trust myself to lack the energy to be destructive. I am fairly confident that in my lowest, I won't even have the energy to commit suicide even if I want to.
Mania is a very different beast altogether. It might manifest on a spectrum from "just too wired up for sleep" to, in a couple of really badly unmanaged episodes, going off to an entirely different part of the country on a whim just because "who cares, I'm dying anyways?" Only through sheer luck did I manage to get home safe both times.
That said, honest self-awareness, honesty to the mental health professionals, and sticking to the treatment plan could make it manageable. It's no guarantee, but it helps.
It also helps to manage expectations: the treatment won't be on target especially on the first states, while the doctors adjust the medication and the dosage, deal with the side effects, etc. Some kind of faith in the process is necessary, I think--not blind trust, but trust that if you inform the doctors honestly any effects (side effects or not) to the best of your abilities, then the doctors can manage the condition better than if you think "I feel fine, the meds aren't needed anymore!"
The treatment--the management of the condition is likely to last until the very end, and that's fine.
About being in a relationship? It's really up to the person and their partner: I wouldn't trust myself to go on in a relationship without at least informing my partner about it--and keeping them up to date with "my mood weather report". However it probably takes experience, a few cycles to get used to it.
Thanks for sharing!
The thing that makes me most hopeful is his attitude. He really seems to be dedicated to making the treatment work.
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My son has been diagnosed with bipolar disorder. He's in his mid-twenties, so it's the average time for onset of bipolar disorder. No family history that we know of, but if it was just two generations back, it probably wouldn't have been talked about.
He had his first manic episode early in the year. He spent a brief time in in-patient treatment, followed by a period of out-patient treatment. During the out-patient treatment, his psychiatrist started to think the diagnosis was incorrect and she weaned him off his meds.
He has had another manic episode, and he's back in the in-patient facility. Luckily he was able to get back into the same place he was in before, so they aren't starting from zero. They started him back on different meds, and he's much better much faster than the first time.
His fiancee was talking to a friend and someone overheard. The person who overheard said her mother was bipolar and she had to take her to the hospital six times, and she told his fiancee that she should break up with him.
The only experts I've spoken to have been the doctors in the crisis center, and I don't know to what degree they are trying to sugar coat things to prevent us from giving up hope.
I'd rather know the reality.
If anyone has any personal experience they can share, I'd appreciate it. If anyone has any professional experience they can share, I'd appreciate that as well.
EDIT: Just wanted to add to this that we were able to visit him today, and he's doing very well.
Sounds like others covered all the bases already but, if you have further specific questions, I'm bipolar and a therapist, and happy to discuss
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My son has been diagnosed with bipolar disorder. He's in his mid-twenties, so it's the average time for onset of bipolar disorder. No family history that we know of, but if it was just two generations back, it probably wouldn't have been talked about.
He had his first manic episode early in the year. He spent a brief time in in-patient treatment, followed by a period of out-patient treatment. During the out-patient treatment, his psychiatrist started to think the diagnosis was incorrect and she weaned him off his meds.
He has had another manic episode, and he's back in the in-patient facility. Luckily he was able to get back into the same place he was in before, so they aren't starting from zero. They started him back on different meds, and he's much better much faster than the first time.
His fiancee was talking to a friend and someone overheard. The person who overheard said her mother was bipolar and she had to take her to the hospital six times, and she told his fiancee that she should break up with him.
The only experts I've spoken to have been the doctors in the crisis center, and I don't know to what degree they are trying to sugar coat things to prevent us from giving up hope.
I'd rather know the reality.
If anyone has any personal experience they can share, I'd appreciate it. If anyone has any professional experience they can share, I'd appreciate that as well.
EDIT: Just wanted to add to this that we were able to visit him today, and he's doing very well.
Stepbrother has it and ultimately his mother died from it.
He's fine on his meds, but finding one's that worked was apparently bad. But once they did he's fine. Glad he managed to find them, hope he stays on them.
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Hi, Bipolar NOS (“not otherwise specified”) here, more down than up. It’s absolutely possible to do great. Like your son, early 20s onset, spent some time inpatient to get sorted out, and have been in consistent outpatient therapy and psychiatry treatment ever since. Completed a PhD program, got married, job market sucks but I’m still optimistic all things considered. I think consistency in treatment, lots of patience, and a good psychiatrist who you can trust are key.
My spiel on the medication part, and some bipolar stigma: some people want to chase the mania, or get a little hypomania and think they’re doing better and don’t need the meds, or think the medication “stifles creativity,” and they give us a bad name. Think Kanye. For every up, there is a down. Not every up is good. The down is far worse. For me, it’s important to remember how bad things can get, because I don’t want that. Whatever side effects and months/years of tinkering with medications are worth it, to me, over losing my spouse, friends, family, or even my life.
Yes, the process of trying medications sucks, but it’s entirely necessary. Also have a good plan for if things get suddenly worse, because they absolutely can — a dud batch of mood stabilizers from when your pharmacy switches manufacturers, for example.
I could literally go on forever, but the tl;dr is that you can do great, just be prepared to put some time and effort into it. And never stop taking medications because you think/feel you’re doing better.
This is the first time I've ever heard of a "dud batch". How common is that? That scares the shit out of me as a person with decently managed mental illness.
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As a person with a bipolar parent I won’t go near a bipolar person if I can help it. They’re often ok if you’re not too close but it’s only a matter of time until they flip on you and the nature of the disorder is inherently self reinforcing, like most personality disorders. I know some people with bipolar claim to manage with meds and what not but they’re still always off in noticeable ways and I’ve never met a bipolar person I would trust to stay on their meds with out constant supervision and enforcement, idk why so many bipolar people love going off their meds so much but in my experience it’s universal and most will lie to you that they’re still taking them even when it’s obvious they’re not.
I’m sorry you’re both dealing with this and I’m sorry my comment isn’t positive but in my nearly 40 years on this earth that’s what my experience with bipolar people has been
Bipolar isn't a personality disorder, it's a mood disorder. Otherwise, obviously I can't convince you of my sincerity, but I am genuinely terrified of ever wanting to go off my medications. Thankfully it hasn't crossed my mind seriously once in ~8 years.
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We'll have to ask that. I don't think it's been said, although it's possible that it went past me without me understanding.
This is a really good podcast by an actual psychiatrist about it. Don't listen to Andrew Huberman and his garbage science.
The important thing is getting the meds right, and taking them faithfully. They really do work remarkably well but figuring out what to take is hard. But plenty of people do really well on them, I have type 2 myself, and I work normally and have lots of friends, and you'd really never know because I've been on them for years and am really even Steven and responsible and calm and managing fine.
I think type 1 is harder in many ways because the manic episodes are so disabling, but type 2 is really hard to diagnose and makes you WILDLY irritable. A work friend recently got diagnosed, she's a very educated physician, and yet she ended up manic, and I do believe she maxed out her credit cards, and was driving recklessly and wrecked her tire, and she ended up hospitalized after telling ALL of her friends and colleagues on WhatsApp, which she has no memory of, as well as being really out of it trying to do clinics. It has devastated her and I'm honestly not sure she'll ever be able to work again.
https://www.psychiatrypodcast.com/psychiatry-psychotherapy-podcast/dealing-with-bipolar-illness
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This is the first time I've ever heard of a "dud batch". How common is that? That scares the shit out of me as a person with decently managed mental illness.
I don’t have any real stats, but out of multiple meds per month since 2007, I had maybe two ever fail on me. The pharmacy fixed it immediately and made a note to only fill from a certain generic supplier.
Also, while generics are technically made with the same active ingredient, the rest of the pill can make a difference. There’s one med that I’ve had from about 8 different manufacturers over the years and while half are good, there’s one that makes me extra tired, another that wears off early, etc.
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My son has been diagnosed with bipolar disorder. He's in his mid-twenties, so it's the average time for onset of bipolar disorder. No family history that we know of, but if it was just two generations back, it probably wouldn't have been talked about.
He had his first manic episode early in the year. He spent a brief time in in-patient treatment, followed by a period of out-patient treatment. During the out-patient treatment, his psychiatrist started to think the diagnosis was incorrect and she weaned him off his meds.
He has had another manic episode, and he's back in the in-patient facility. Luckily he was able to get back into the same place he was in before, so they aren't starting from zero. They started him back on different meds, and he's much better much faster than the first time.
His fiancee was talking to a friend and someone overheard. The person who overheard said her mother was bipolar and she had to take her to the hospital six times, and she told his fiancee that she should break up with him.
The only experts I've spoken to have been the doctors in the crisis center, and I don't know to what degree they are trying to sugar coat things to prevent us from giving up hope.
I'd rather know the reality.
If anyone has any personal experience they can share, I'd appreciate it. If anyone has any professional experience they can share, I'd appreciate that as well.
EDIT: Just wanted to add to this that we were able to visit him today, and he's doing very well.
Mental health counselor here.
The outcomes of treatment for bipolar disorder are unfortunately very variable. It depends on how severe your son’s symptoms are, how well he responds to the medications cocktail he’s being given, what that medication cocktail is, and how well he adheres to it.
The important thing is that your son controls what he can control, which is largely whether or not he takes his meds and how much he engages in therapy. Therapeutic skills involve insight/mindfulness work (i.e. how well your son can recognize his symptoms as they’re happening) and resource use (i.e. does he inform his therapist and/or psychiatrist when he notices he’s be king symptomatic). Mania often feels amazing to people experiencing it, so they’re often motivated against treating it when it occurs, and this is major barrier to treatment.
A big component is whether or not symptoms of psychosis are involved in either the mania or depression. Psychotic symptoms are: 1.) hallucinations (false sensory perceptions, like hearing voices, seeing things, smelling things, etc), 2.) delusions (false beliefs that don’t conform to “normal” societal beliefs, like “I am Jesus” or “God has a mission for me”), and 3.) paranoia (i.e. feeling people around you are hostile to you or are spying on you, etc). These can be experienced in either mood state, but are most often seen in manic states.
I would suggest getting in touch with an organization called NAMI (National Alliance for the Mentally Ill) as they have tons of resources for people struggling with mental illness and family members of mentally ill people.
