The worst thing about Linux is its users
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Really tired of "Linux user sucks" joke.
We all know some obnoxious people exist and are annoying but they are small minority confined to their own space.On the other side, everyday I see Linux people working on their free time or for little to no pay on accessibility issues, bettering software for everyone (including windows users). I also see community members doing their best to answer, document and work with newcomer to fix their issues. I see developers burning out because they received another report insulting their work because a feature doesn't work exactly like windows, etc...
Maybe I'm reading too much into this, sorry if that's the case.
wrote last edited by [email protected]We all know some obnoxious people exist and are annoying but they are small minority confined to their own space.
But why did that space have to be lemmy?
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I am going to take the bet.
The thing is : microsoft won't stop spying, collecting data is a nice business, and also most people don't need windows:
- Office docs can be open through onlyoffice, or you can also switch to libreoffice (the best option would be raw text like markdown or csv with a nice editor)
- Who really needs advanced photoshop stuff that gimp can't provide ? AI ? (also gimp devs just revamped the project to bring modern features inside the editing core)
- web browsers work on linux.
- only kernel anticheats do not work on linux because kernel. Shame on the devs for needing a full fledge malware when it is purely cat and mouse (and if game devs could provide hostable private servers this would be nice). Also, I don't know if it works but this project exists
Finally, posting this on the fediverse is a bit ironic : why would you go on a small userbase social network when you can just go on facebook, X, bluesky or reddit ?
I personally prefer Krita to Gimp, otherwise my real issues with Linux being:
- Lack of pro audio support. Sure, a lot of open source plugins are available on Linux, but only 1 usable DAW (Ardour), and even that has it's own "issues" (de facto paid, if you don't want to wrestle with exact compiler and make versions the devs won't tell you).
- X11 is kind of dated, while Wayland is still not up to the task.
- GNOME devs. After all the sabotage, probably done in order to force people to use GTK and their UX design sensibilities, they should be banned from any Wayland protocol discussion.
- Elitist users. They'll scream at you online for using a normal text editor instead of VIM, they want you to write little automated scripts for GDB instead of using something with a normal GUI, etc.
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Those tribal linux-neckbeards need this to feel superior. Who cares for their opinion?
I use both as tools for the job at hand. One always fits better than the other. It's not a cult, it's an OS
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Fair enough, could have used better comparison
Wasn't meant condescending or anything. You didn't mean harm. It's just that victims, who hear this attitude a lot (because it seems so bloody obviously easy), might be pissed.
Same like "why are you even homeless? Just buy a house, doh!" -
I personally prefer Krita to Gimp, otherwise my real issues with Linux being:
- Lack of pro audio support. Sure, a lot of open source plugins are available on Linux, but only 1 usable DAW (Ardour), and even that has it's own "issues" (de facto paid, if you don't want to wrestle with exact compiler and make versions the devs won't tell you).
- X11 is kind of dated, while Wayland is still not up to the task.
- GNOME devs. After all the sabotage, probably done in order to force people to use GTK and their UX design sensibilities, they should be banned from any Wayland protocol discussion.
- Elitist users. They'll scream at you online for using a normal text editor instead of VIM, they want you to write little automated scripts for GDB instead of using something with a normal GUI, etc.
Bitwig has a Linux version. It's proprietary and paid, but it's very nice to use and comes with a ton of devices.
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The problem is no matter how badly we want that to be true, Linux just still is not stable enough or user friendly enough for the average user. Unless you're ready to be a system admin full-time for someone you're giving a Linux device to, it's pointless. Even the simple ones like Mint? It's too much for my elderly mom, she gets lost too easily. It's just too demanding of average users, simple as that.
I want people to switch to Linux too, but this is exactly why this comic is dead-accurate, because it's just not ready for average users and likely won't be anytime soon. Why? Because Linux gives you control, and giving you control is actually demanding of your time and energy and effort. People like Windows or macOS because they don't have to expend time, energy, and effort, it just "works" well enough for them to use it passively.
There are worse things in the world than regular people not being able to handle Linux.
Have you used it since the 90s? Something like Ubuntu does literally everything for you - drivers, printers, the works.
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Bitwig has a Linux version. It's proprietary and paid, but it's very nice to use and comes with a ton of devices.
So does Reaper.
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Wasn't meant condescending or anything. You didn't mean harm. It's just that victims, who hear this attitude a lot (because it seems so bloody obviously easy), might be pissed.
Same like "why are you even homeless? Just buy a house, doh!"Yeah no offense taken. You explained well why there was a problem and it's always a good thing
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The problem is no matter how badly we want that to be true, Linux just still is not stable enough or user friendly enough for the average user. Unless you're ready to be a system admin full-time for someone you're giving a Linux device to, it's pointless. Even the simple ones like Mint? It's too much for my elderly mom, she gets lost too easily. It's just too demanding of average users, simple as that.
I want people to switch to Linux too, but this is exactly why this comic is dead-accurate, because it's just not ready for average users and likely won't be anytime soon. Why? Because Linux gives you control, and giving you control is actually demanding of your time and energy and effort. People like Windows or macOS because they don't have to expend time, energy, and effort, it just "works" well enough for them to use it passively.
There are worse things in the world than regular people not being able to handle Linux.
Both my parents use linux mint with 0 issues.
my dad is abysmal at tech, never sent an email, hates the concept of passwords etc, etc.
Other than resetting Facebook passwords and replacing a laptop battery, they have never needed a thing from me.
Out of curiosity, what is it that you mom wanted from a pc?
My parents only ever seem to use their web browser, which is identical to the windows experiance.
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Windows isnt built for you its built for me, a Systems Admin.
It is so easy to get all my corporate logging and compliance software onto that thing. Its objectively spyware but the feds and the insurance companies said to do it so I do.
Oh and copilot, by the gods, its so nice to give Microsoft full access to all my emails, teams messages, and notes so it can so quickly answer questions for me on everything. Only works if it's ya know spying on you and you're spending hundreds a year to use it. But it is great.
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The problem is no matter how badly we want that to be true, Linux just still is not stable enough or user friendly enough for the average user. Unless you're ready to be a system admin full-time for someone you're giving a Linux device to, it's pointless. Even the simple ones like Mint? It's too much for my elderly mom, she gets lost too easily. It's just too demanding of average users, simple as that.
I want people to switch to Linux too, but this is exactly why this comic is dead-accurate, because it's just not ready for average users and likely won't be anytime soon. Why? Because Linux gives you control, and giving you control is actually demanding of your time and energy and effort. People like Windows or macOS because they don't have to expend time, energy, and effort, it just "works" well enough for them to use it passively.
There are worse things in the world than regular people not being able to handle Linux.
This is false information
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We all know some obnoxious people exist and are annoying but they are small minority confined to their own space.
But why did that space have to be lemmy?
I think the people who want free and opensource social media overlap with people wanting a free and opensource OS. But I don’t think everyone here uses linux and I don’t think most people that do are obnoxious.
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I think it mostly comes down to baby duck syndrome. People don't like using a package manager for programs on their desktop but are fine using an app store on their phone (which might literally be running linux). People simply expect a desktop computer to work a specific way and when things are in different spots and called different things they get upset. I think it's changing as more companies bake Linux into their product.
Steam Decks running Linux changes people's impression of it. If a mainstream company sold desktop computers that came with Linux preinstalled I'm sure its use would skyrocket. It's not that it's impossible for the average user to understand, It's that it's not the default option.
wrote last edited by [email protected]Lenovo will sell you a thinkpad with your favorite distro preinstalled. I bought an X1 carbon with fedora 38 on it. BIOS updates and all.
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I think the people who want free and opensource social media overlap with people wanting a free and opensource OS. But I don’t think everyone here uses linux and I don’t think most people that do are obnoxious.
I am though.
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Can’t we agree on both? I don’t want microsoft to spy on me and I would like people to switch to linux.
wrote last edited by [email protected]Also, i can't do shit about microsoft. It's only gonna keep getting worse.
I cannot make them not suck. An update will undo anything i do to liberate your machine.
Literally the only solutions i have for 'ms please don't spy' are 'air gap' and 'linux'.
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The problem is no matter how badly we want that to be true, Linux just still is not stable enough or user friendly enough for the average user. Unless you're ready to be a system admin full-time for someone you're giving a Linux device to, it's pointless. Even the simple ones like Mint? It's too much for my elderly mom, she gets lost too easily. It's just too demanding of average users, simple as that.
I want people to switch to Linux too, but this is exactly why this comic is dead-accurate, because it's just not ready for average users and likely won't be anytime soon. Why? Because Linux gives you control, and giving you control is actually demanding of your time and energy and effort. People like Windows or macOS because they don't have to expend time, energy, and effort, it just "works" well enough for them to use it passively.
There are worse things in the world than regular people not being able to handle Linux.
wrote last edited by [email protected]average user
So, while i first encountered this in software, because i was a nerdy little shit, I've found it in a lot of other things since gstting into otg activism:
We infantilize the shit out of people, and as long as they're kept in a cradle, they will not outgrow it, only wither and die when their tike comes.
Claiming agency for ones self is necessarily challenging. You will fuck up, casting off your chains and taking your first steps towards becoming an autonomous individual. It's just a thing. In politics/conscience, in software, in sexuality, in riding a bike; whatever. It's unavoidable, and, imo; usually fine. What i can do is help troubleshoot and make your ass keep backups.
You'll be better and more capable for having surpassed the challenge.
There was actually a major bifurcation in ux design around precisely this issue. Doug englebart on the not-evil side, steve 'toilet feet nevershower' jobs on the other.
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"Complaint"
"Solution"
"No, only complaint
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I think windows also kinda sucks for older people and less technologically inclined people.
Windows is what people are used to, doesn’t mean it is better. I think there are a bunch of linux distros that would work just as well for older people.
Yeah, my grandma had to call my mom and I to help her with Windows to stop uploading everything to OneDrive, and even I fucking hate fighting Windows over OneDrive. I think she could live with Fedora or Mint and be okay, unless there's a specific app she needed.
My grandma actually used to be a computer professor back in the 80s or so, but I guess use it or lose it lol.
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The problem is no matter how badly we want that to be true, Linux just still is not stable enough or user friendly enough for the average user. Unless you're ready to be a system admin full-time for someone you're giving a Linux device to, it's pointless. Even the simple ones like Mint? It's too much for my elderly mom, she gets lost too easily. It's just too demanding of average users, simple as that.
I want people to switch to Linux too, but this is exactly why this comic is dead-accurate, because it's just not ready for average users and likely won't be anytime soon. Why? Because Linux gives you control, and giving you control is actually demanding of your time and energy and effort. People like Windows or macOS because they don't have to expend time, energy, and effort, it just "works" well enough for them to use it passively.
There are worse things in the world than regular people not being able to handle Linux.
Eh, I think outside of potential language/accessibility/hardware incompatibility issues that I've read on blogs/comments, Linux works for the "average" user. It's the slightly "advanced" user like me who struggles, and the "truly advanced" who swim like a duck in water in any distro. Like the bell curve meme.
I say this cause if I literally only needed some apps and the browser, I wouldn't struggle. But I do tinker with things and end up needing slightly uncommon software/features that require me to use the CLI (and my dumbass can't remember commands), even though I'm mid at using the CLI. Meanwhile, people born with a usb-stick in hand love the CLI and use it for everything, even things I would try to avoid unless I felt it was easier.
A kid I know has put his grandparents on Fedora, and has no issues. It comes down to the person. If they can click some buttons and read, and only wanna use office, browser, and a app or two, they'd probably live. Yeah, you might have to tinker how it looks for them or put the apps on the desktop, but outside of that, it's simple.
Windows definitely doesn't "just work", I had to figure out Windows decided to kill my Wifi adapter whenever my laptop would go in sleep (god... why???). OneDrive is an ass, devices not wanting to connect (Bluetooth controllers), printers, etc. I'll give you that Mac works pretty well for those who like it, but I hate Apple and never got used to Mac. I still can't remove some shitty old virus scanner that doesn't work anyway and it can't update anymore, so it just rots on our computer. So like, Mac has their off-days with me too (one time FF nuked itself...)
