Bad UX is keeping the majority of people away from Lemmy
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Yeah but you have to see it through the normal-user eyes, for them just creating a new account is a whole ordeal, then they see that ordeal makes them investigate the server before picking and then it turns out they picked wrong... For them that's that and they delete the app (never deleting the account, mind you), branding the whole lemmy experience under whatever server they picked first.
If there was some sort of... Quiz? That could help them pick... But a brutally honest one, since some instances have pretty extremists opinions, new users have to know what they are dealing with.
I could see merit to that argilument if the sign-ups process was kind've a pain, but honestly it's so easy to create an account on Lemmy it's hard to give that too much credence. Most servers just want a username and a password, and many don't even require an email to verify. If putting in a username and password somewhere else because they didn't like their first instance is too much for them, that's a pretty flighty user to begin with, and they would probably leave for a host of other reasons too.
Saying that, a better way to narrow down that initial choice of server would not go amiss, but ultimately people will need to understand that this is all run by volunteers and there may be more bumps than a corporate controlled platform, but the other advantages (if they appeal to this theoretical user) are worth it.
Even with a better server picking tool, and even if they pick a server they like the first time, it's possible that server has to shut down some day due to unforeseen circumstances, and that user will have to either accept that they have to create a new account somewhere, or decide that's not an ideal UX and never come back, which would be a shame, but impossible to prevent.
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I think two communities could have a consensual federation - where posts from each community shows up in each community's feed.
But then why not merge them, it just solves all of the issues?
Why even have a script for that now https://lemmy.world/post/24312613
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This reddit post likely has tens if not hundreds of thousands of views, look at the top comment.
Lemmy is losing so many potential new users because the UX sucks for the vast majority of people.
What can we do?
I think a big problem is a lot of the explainers for new users, at least the ones that were around back when I first joined Mastodon, were or are absolute dog shit. They were all existential explanations rather than practical ones. I was trying to figure out which instance to join, and why one might be better for me than another, and every explainer I saw was basically a variation on, "iT's JuSt LikE EmAiL. wHy Is tHaT hArD? sToP bEiNg So sTuPid, DuMmY." None of them really explained the user experience, and how different instances might affect it, let alone the existence of the local and global feeds and how your instance choice affects those. It was like asking someone how to use chopsticks and them telling you, "It's easy. Just put food in your mouth with them. Works just like a fork."
Technically true, but it omits some pretty crucial information.
Once you're into it and have the lay of the land, it seems really simple in retrospect. But if you're coming in cold with no idea how any of it works, and the only help you get is some dickhead shouting, "EmAiL! iT's LiKe EmAiL!" then the learning curve seems a lot steeper than it actually is.
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This is fantastic thank you, I've created an account. I like the onboarding
I think it will probably address a few of the issues you have with Lemmy, and then you will join the piefed enthusiasts like @[email protected] @[email protected]
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This reddit post likely has tens if not hundreds of thousands of views, look at the top comment.
Lemmy is losing so many potential new users because the UX sucks for the vast majority of people.
What can we do?
Could have auto versus manual server choice. Can always maintain option for granular selection, but "normies" could walk into a quiz when migrating?
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Top three things you used Reddit for? (List of maybe 10+ things, servers can maintain their feature list to empower this)
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Do you like A) talking to everybody about days topics B) talking to a smaller group of like minded people
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Do you like A) a MORE moderated space B) a LESS moderated space, realizing you may see more spam and controversy
And then calculates a server that meets needs, if multiple, then random number generator to assign a server. On user side, all they see is a quiz followed by a typical registration screen. This would help with distribution of users across niche servers, but feel lighter for user. They also would assume a more curated experience, regardless of where they end up. Servers could have to opt in to be fed users from search of they were afraid of impact on cost to maintain server.
The above likely aren't the right questions, but this framework could be effective
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Email is well established and has incredible UX.
Email wasn't competing with a well established centralised version of Email with a vastly superior UX when it was trying to gain users.
Lemmy doesn't exist in a vacuum
Using email is the worst experience in the world. There’s no security, no standard for quotes, no delivery guarantee, a patchwork of attachment deliverability guidelines and you have to understand things like bcc in order to not commit bizarre faux-pas all the time.
Email sucks and I can’t believe a person who wants to have a conversation about ux would seriously hold it up as a positive example.
Email literally replaced messaging held in shared files between time users of mainframes. It replaced the most centralized system imaginable which had a ux that required no additional understanding or training of a mainframe user. Twenty years after its inception, major universities still had to have special training classes to make sure students and faculty could use email.
The problem of people not joining lemmy/activitypub isn’t the ux of choosing a server. The problem is no one wants to leave reddit enough to do so. Lemmy doesn’t offer anything except possibly the same experience as being on some idealized version of reddit so why would users flock to it?
A better approach would be try to be a better platform than reddit like reddit was to digg, like digg was to slashdot etc. that’s what hexbear and beehaw do.
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Uh yeah. I’ve got no clue how to find new communities? Instances? Groups? Whatever the hell the equivalent of a subreddit is called. It’s not user friendly at all.
Lemmyverse.net is the best way to search across all instances for communities that would interest you.
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This reddit post likely has tens if not hundreds of thousands of views, look at the top comment.
Lemmy is losing so many potential new users because the UX sucks for the vast majority of people.
What can we do?
New users get overwhelmed with decision fatigue, especially when they have average intelligence.
When selecting a federation, new users should be told:
"Because Lemmy isn't run by a large corporation, lots of small volunteers run Lemmy and run different copies of Lemmy at the same time. These different copies are called instances. You can choose 1 or just click the large red button and we'll randomly select one of the most popular instances for you. If you aren't sure what to choose, just press the button!"
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Gonna don my tinfoil hat here for a second...
Was the monetization of the API a deliberate move to kick out the progressive and tech-literate long-time reddit users (myself included, with 16 year badge and centuryclub), to in turn make the site more of a Nazi, pro-Trump circle jerk?
Because I really think it succeeded. The whole atmosphere shifted that day, and I've barely been back except when I end up there out of muscle memory or a Google result...and those often have the best answers removed by someone who went through and scrubbed their account.
We all remember how Spez treated r/thedonald, right?
I have a post early on Lemmy, around the migration, about how it felt like any morality and responsibility to objective fact over there left with our initially migrating group. The change is subtle, but it's crazy how far you have to scroll into the comments now to find the buried correct answer that refutes the misinformation in the title or linked article.
Also, the "which movie is this for you?" Type posts have just saturated over there. As well as shit, obscure linked sources (e g. "Indiatrump.biz" "realzgovtruth.info" kind of shit), as sources of front page upvoted posts, seem so much more prevalent over there now.
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"Wah wah it's so hard to pick a server!"
JUST LIKE EMAIL YOU NITWIT!
The problem is, and was for me too - that's not how people think of email. Saying "pick a server" is really arcane for most people, even "pick a domain." The fediverse as a whole has a terminology and jargon problem it still hasn't completely reckoned with, or at least figured out.
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Yea getting into Lemmy is confusing. I only use sync because it's easier, I have no idea how to even access it on desktop. It definitely needs some QoL improvements before I can really start recommending it to people
There is a reason such a large part of Lemmy is developers. There's no confusion signing up for the developers. Federations and servers and instances are all crazy jargon to regular people. Although we may not want all regular types here, having some more regular people to balance out all the high IQ techies could make things more fun.
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Have tell new users just sign up on your instance. Make it less confusing by sending them to a specific website and not just telling them about the software.
I swear to God, there are so many tech people here that overthink it because they know details that the average user would not give a single fuck about.
This exactly. Once I dove in and stopped reading, it oddly made more sense to me.
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Create username and password
Sign into preferred app from your favorite store.I liked old reddit, and Baconreader, so for me Jerboa was great
Jerboa is awesome, and it's come a very long way in a really short timespan.
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To access it on desktop, just open the browser and type your server's URL (in your case, lemmy.world)
I guess we have to roll back from "apps for everything", or else many people might genuinely not know how to access their instance.
There are people who don't realize that reddit is a website. Stew on that for a minute.
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I think a big problem is a lot of the explainers for new users, at least the ones that were around back when I first joined Mastodon, were or are absolute dog shit. They were all existential explanations rather than practical ones. I was trying to figure out which instance to join, and why one might be better for me than another, and every explainer I saw was basically a variation on, "iT's JuSt LikE EmAiL. wHy Is tHaT hArD? sToP bEiNg So sTuPid, DuMmY." None of them really explained the user experience, and how different instances might affect it, let alone the existence of the local and global feeds and how your instance choice affects those. It was like asking someone how to use chopsticks and them telling you, "It's easy. Just put food in your mouth with them. Works just like a fork."
Technically true, but it omits some pretty crucial information.
Once you're into it and have the lay of the land, it seems really simple in retrospect. But if you're coming in cold with no idea how any of it works, and the only help you get is some dickhead shouting, "EmAiL! iT's LiKe EmAiL!" then the learning curve seems a lot steeper than it actually is.
Very well said! -
Could have auto versus manual server choice. Can always maintain option for granular selection, but "normies" could walk into a quiz when migrating?
-
Top three things you used Reddit for? (List of maybe 10+ things, servers can maintain their feature list to empower this)
-
Do you like A) talking to everybody about days topics B) talking to a smaller group of like minded people
-
Do you like A) a MORE moderated space B) a LESS moderated space, realizing you may see more spam and controversy
And then calculates a server that meets needs, if multiple, then random number generator to assign a server. On user side, all they see is a quiz followed by a typical registration screen. This would help with distribution of users across niche servers, but feel lighter for user. They also would assume a more curated experience, regardless of where they end up. Servers could have to opt in to be fed users from search of they were afraid of impact on cost to maintain server.
The above likely aren't the right questions, but this framework could be effective
Somebody will have to host that. Whether it's a Lemmy app developer, or baked into the Lemmy codebase itself.
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This reddit post likely has tens if not hundreds of thousands of views, look at the top comment.
Lemmy is losing so many potential new users because the UX sucks for the vast majority of people.
What can we do?
Multi-reddits on Lemmy!
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Regardless if it was the plan, it's the result.
I can't stand what it has become, especially when some of the most problematic subs have massive influence over the rest of the site, like wsb.
I just wish you had recourse for false (or maybe even correct, but heavy handed) bans, and it's still the largest gathering place for many communities - retro games, queer communities, other adult interest (not just pornography) spaces, local events/happenings, so it's really terrible to just be completely shut out of all of that. Whether voluntarily or not. (In my case not.)
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This reddit post likely has tens if not hundreds of thousands of views, look at the top comment.
Lemmy is losing so many potential new users because the UX sucks for the vast majority of people.
What can we do?
I think Lemmy needs a higher-level sign-up procedure that hides the complexity of the fediverse. This could be a webpage with a simple, clutter-free interface that handles picking and registering on an instance from a curated list semi-automatically, for example, by asking you 3-4 questions before giving you a suggested server that fits your responses (that you can change) with a button to register right away (and handle the occasional additional sign-up requirements that some instances have).
IMHO, 90% of users will never interact with the "federation" aspects of Lemmy after that, and they also don't need to. I personally don't feel like Lemmy being federated has much of an impact on my user experience day to day.
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I wasn't gonna say anything but that's another issue with the userbase on Lemmy.
It's occupied by a lot of people who think they are better and smarter than everyone else. Not that reddit didn't also have that problem but the smugness levels are definitely way higher around these parts.
I'm sure it'll go away with time, hopefully as more people join and contribute.
