US deliberately orchestrated Zelensky-Trump Oval Office clash, Friedrich Merz says
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The US is a representative democracy, and those were its chosen representatives. Sorry, but you can't collectively vote Trump into office and then immediately go "woah, we have nothing to do with any of this!" When he turns out to be exactly what everyone expected him to be.
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Right? I have been consistently underwhelmed at how… well, flaccid Scholz has been on the European leadership front. Dude comes off like he wants everything signed in triplicate before he’s willing to consider appointing a discussion board to evaluate possibility of thinking about making a decision.
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Trump and Vance aren't actors, it shows.
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Orchestrated or not, it was a fucking cowardly spectacle.
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It's actually looking pretty likely that they didn't actually win. How very odd that Musk is suddenly buddy buddy with Trump, when he oh so very coincidentally has a team of programmer man children who have a number of proof of concept examples for invisibly changing votes on voting machines.
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lol the voters are not who gets represented in American “democracy”, it’s the donors. One of them is literally occupying the office of the president and wreaking absolute havoc.
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I’m American. You need to face reality: our compatriots did this. Our friends (or former friends, perhaps), neighbors, and family did this. Either with enthusiasm or through complacency, they consented to this trump bullshit. He won the fucking popular vote. It is an indictment upon us all, collectively.
Let me be clear: fuck us. We deserve what’s coming. My hope is that Starmer, Macron, and Metz can take the helm and guide the West through this.
If I didn’t have such strong ties to this country through my career and my family, I’d fuck off to Canada. I am ashamed to be American. Maybe one day, that’ll change. Maybe.
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I’d also like to point out that, of those remaining 200 million or so, 90 million decided to sit out the election altogether. They, in my mind, are just as responsible for letting all of this happen as are those who voted for it.
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Happy cakes
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Especially because he has always been a staunch atlanticist with a ton of connections in the US. That and the fact this comes from Germany, the most pro-US country, barring the UK, in Europe, gives his words extra gravitas.
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Do you have any sources I can read up on? This is the first I hear of this.
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It's also extremely disingenous to claim that our country doesn't support Trump. A majority of Americans are happy to support the status quo that Trump represents. They're just mad that the billionaires have dropped the mask and stopped using lube while fucking them, but they still want to be fucked. They voted for neoliberal exploitation this election, just like they voted for neoliberal exploitation in the last dozen elections. If Americans really wanted to avoid fascism, they should have started doing something about it at least 40 years ago.
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It’s your country, your attempt at a democratic system and your mess to deal with internally. That it’s a fundamentally broken system you have over there has been known (and in some cases mathematically proven) for a long time now. Personally, I’m getting tired of the ”Not all americans”-stuff. It kinda worked the first time around, but you had four years to deal with him peacefully through your legal system, demonstrations, manifestations and public pressure. He got reelected and there was a peaceful transition of power, possibly the last.
Enough people voted for him. The margins weren’t even that thin. You are now represented by President Orange in your international affairs and force projection. We can’t really help you that much either, as you have positioned yourselves as a dominant global power, with economical, soft and hard power.
My entirely unqualified guess - we’ll start accepting political refugees from the US, fearing for their lives, fairly soon. I’m guessing LGBTQ+, some ethnicities, some scientists and some public servants are in the danger zone. Stop being ”horrified” and start being ”absolutely fucking terrified”.
In short, go deal with your carrot man, we can’t do it for you. We can hopefully provide some refuge. But we can only deal with you as a nation, represented by Trump. Sorry.
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Yeah Merz seems reasonable geopolitically speaking, and seems willing to make the hard choices. I'm not terribly sad about Scholz losing to him, especially as another GroKo is most likely to happen.
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Trump is a weak person's view of a strong person. It only looked good to those weak people.
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It was my very first thought too. Well, second after what a complete twat JD Vance was. But it just seemed so oddly paced. Like I've never seen a conversation go like that it was so strange. It felt really contrived. Course it could be chalked up to insane immaturity too so idk.
I mean Trump's answer to what if Russia breaks the ceasefire was
What if the bomb drops on your head right now? OK, what if they broke it? I don’t know, they broke it with Biden because Biden, they didn’t respect him. They didn’t respect Obama. They respect me."
So essentially his answer to what happens if they break the ceasefire was... they won't break it? But no, zelensky is the world's biggest asshole for wanting to know about securities.
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Vance going on about how the goal is a ceasefire to end the war, Zelensky relying that ceasefires haven't been followed by Russia, and the Trump.and Vance going off on 'disrepect' was just wild. Like reality tv scripted argument level wild. Saturday Night Live parodied the meeting and the parody was toned down compared to the actual meeting!
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While obviously if presented with sufficient evidence I’m willing to change my position, I would be shocked if this turns out to be the case. The result was well-within a normal polling error. No reason to act like the Qaninnies and start throwing around vote fraud conspiracies without proof.
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It was obviously performative when Trump said, "you don't get to tell us what we're going to feel" when Zelensky said that the US will feel the effect of the war.
It's was after JD already escalated and Trump had to grab something to be a critical about, and that was the arbitrary point he decided to cling onto. He had to because JD upped the ante and Trump HAD to do something to keep up
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Things like requesting for emotional value in a serious conversation is such an unsophisticated tactic in arguments, just hard to believe it’s planned by a long time blogger and book writer who should be good at words.
