Why I recommend against Brave.
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When did Librewolf stop development?
https://github.com/arkenfox/user.js/issues/1906
Not sure about the health of librewolf either, this thread suggests it's 3 overworked parttimers unable to keep up
"Hey all, I'm on the LibreWolf team, and it's true that since the departure of @fxbrit the project has taken a total nosedive when it comes to keeping up to date with Arkenfox and settings in general. We're still making releases, but settings did not get updated."
"As @threadpanic said, since fxbrit left we have been in a kind of "maintenance" mode in terms of settings. Mainly because we are really only three people left"
"LW since fxbrit left/died/who-knows has gone to shit - I worked with him behind the scenes to make the right choices and while he would do his own analysis, we always agreed, and his voice influenced them. Now they don't know what they are doing, and in fact have compromised security and make really stupid decisions. Same goes for all the other forks - really dubious shit going"
Which I think is one of the big issues with OSS projects - many are based around a very small number of people being motivated to work on something for free. And it dies if that stops.
Exactly.
But I'm still confused about what you mean by the "resources" comment re: Librewolf.
"Resources" can refer to many different things, in this case it is motivation/prioritization.
It's still being kept up to date, just not getting new features, and the security issues have been patched up as they come along. It's not a dead project yet. Maintaining Librewolf isn't impossible since Firefox is doing the heavy lifting.
The main issue is mostly that it relies on Firefox.
Honestly, I don't mind the paid browser route. Browsers, and a lot of software, used to be paid, and it feels like things were less shit when some of it was.
I think ideally we'd see 2 versions of software like some used to be in the 90s - a free, stripped down version that only does basic functions (think Microsoft WordPad Vs Microsoft Word) and a pair full version. This model can still allow FOSS to exist as well, like perhaps having LibreOffice as is, and then having an enterprise version that has additional networking features and support that's paid for businesses, with all money from that going into the maintenance of LibreOffice.
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That's a really concise and thoughtless way to excuse Google, Microsoft and Apple for monetizing spying on every person on earth for profit.
And yes, Linux distros have a business model. I'm happy that distros found a business model through offering official support to corporations, it makes it truly free to the rest of us. It also helps that their competition is very expensive. Will that model work for a browser? What do you think?
That's a really concise and thoughtless way to excuse Google, Microsoft and Apple for monetizing spying on every person on earth for profit.
Nice strawman you got there. I think anyone with eyes can see I didn't bring them up because most (all?) Lemmy users know Firefox and its forks exist.
And yes, Linux distros have a business model. I'm happy that distros found a business model through offering official support to corporations, it makes it truly free to the rest of us. It also helps that their competition is very expensive. Will that model work for a browser? What do you think?
That's... Literally how browsers used to work. Netscape was a paid browser. Orion is starting to look into that model as well.
And yes, you just pointed out of possible to raise funds without pulling the shit Brave has, as Linux distros have done... So, congrats on getting the point? A little slow, but you got there.
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well no you're accusing all the contributors of brave of being a murderer
they stopped murdering a long time ago
Murderer is a noun. Once you've murdered that's what you are, regardless of past or present or future. People can change, but that doesn't change what you've done in the past and have become, because you can't undo what you did.
6 months to 5 years isn't "A long time ago" btw. I think it takes at least a decade to start considering something a long time ago.
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God damnit.
Every browser I switched to since Firefox has been a good user experience, and then I find out some horrible bullshit.
Is there any safe browser that isn't run by hateful assholes?
FF is starting to enshittify because they depend on Google for their revenue
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Murderer is a noun. Once you've murdered that's what you are, regardless of past or present or future. People can change, but that doesn't change what you've done in the past and have become, because you can't undo what you did.
6 months to 5 years isn't "A long time ago" btw. I think it takes at least a decade to start considering something a long time ago.
you know murderers get rehabilitated and released all the time
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Also don't use Opera. They're opera-ted by chinese mafia.
Thanks. I read an article yesterday about how it’s one of the best privacy browsers out there.
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Brave has their own built-in ad blocker that still works
It barely block most ads
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Thanks. I read an article yesterday about how it’s one of the best privacy browsers out there.
I prefer either TorBrowser or Waterfox.
TorBrowser is, hands down, the best privacy browser out there but it's a bit slow because it operates like a decentralized VPN.
Waterfox browser is built on Mozilla's Gecko Engine just like firefox, but it isn't managed directly by Mozilla.
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disabling ... Chrome's send-everything-to-Google behaviour.
Is that even possible?
There's Ungoogled Chromium which claims to do just that
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Believing that same-sex marriage shouldn't be a government-supported institution isn't the same as believing LGBT people are "invalid" or "wrong" or whatever.
How is it not?
we should replace it with a series of contracts that grant certain legal privileges
I mean, legally, that's what marriage is.
you may want to join finances w/ someone, but not give them hospital visitation rights
You don't have to do either of those things just because you're married. Marriage just gives you the option.
For example, they could partner w/ someone like Axate
And what would they bring to this partnership?
And if that applies to you, you should be very careful about the tools you use.
You should be. But companies also should not be creating tools that propose to give you those protections when they're not smart enough to. Just leave it to the professionals.
I wouldn't be surprised if GabeN's personal politics were quite conservative
As long as he keeps his mouth shut about them and doesn't financially support them, he's doing worlds better than Mr. Eich.
Is it me or the people defending brave are homophobes too.
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you know murderers get rehabilitated and released all the time
After a significant amount of time. Longer than Brave's blunders. And rehabilitation is not erasure. Likewise, murder enough and society will consider to instead remove the person from society as well instead of rewarding them.
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That's a really concise and thoughtless way to excuse Google, Microsoft and Apple for monetizing spying on every person on earth for profit.
Nice strawman you got there. I think anyone with eyes can see I didn't bring them up because most (all?) Lemmy users know Firefox and its forks exist.
And yes, Linux distros have a business model. I'm happy that distros found a business model through offering official support to corporations, it makes it truly free to the rest of us. It also helps that their competition is very expensive. Will that model work for a browser? What do you think?
That's... Literally how browsers used to work. Netscape was a paid browser. Orion is starting to look into that model as well.
And yes, you just pointed out of possible to raise funds without pulling the shit Brave has, as Linux distros have done... So, congrats on getting the point? A little slow, but you got there.
Nice strawman you got there. I think anyone with eyes can see I didn't bring them up because most (all?) Lemmy users know Firefox and its forks exist.
It's not a strawman, it's the problem. You may not have mentioned it, but I didn't think it needed mentioning, between the three companies I mentioned, they makeup 90% marketable for browsers, that's the vast majority of browsers. Are there others? Absolutely. I primarily use Firefox myself, but they're starting to lean more toward sharing data as well... I don't know what let you think you have to stand in here.
That's... Literally how browsers used to work. Netscape was a paid browser. Orion is starting to look into that model as well.
And Netscape? When was that paid? I can't think of an era when that was paid... Was that like during the Mozilla period, when the browser sucked, or before that? Whatever, that clearly didn't work at any rate, cause they aren't still doing it. But I swear I used to use Netscape in the 90s, I can't remember it being paid...
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Nice strawman you got there. I think anyone with eyes can see I didn't bring them up because most (all?) Lemmy users know Firefox and its forks exist.
It's not a strawman, it's the problem. You may not have mentioned it, but I didn't think it needed mentioning, between the three companies I mentioned, they makeup 90% marketable for browsers, that's the vast majority of browsers. Are there others? Absolutely. I primarily use Firefox myself, but they're starting to lean more toward sharing data as well... I don't know what let you think you have to stand in here.
That's... Literally how browsers used to work. Netscape was a paid browser. Orion is starting to look into that model as well.
And Netscape? When was that paid? I can't think of an era when that was paid... Was that like during the Mozilla period, when the browser sucked, or before that? Whatever, that clearly didn't work at any rate, cause they aren't still doing it. But I swear I used to use Netscape in the 90s, I can't remember it being paid...
It's not a strawman, it's the problem.
It's a strawman you're still trying to prop up because the issue is not only the Brave browser itself, but the owners of it.
Even if we took your argument in good faith, it would still be flawed since Brave is based on Chromium, of which Google essentially controls at this point, so you'd still be supporting Google hegemony. In other words, even from that stance you've brought up, it would be a bad idea to use Brave vs Firefox, Librewolf, Konqueror, etc.
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If you are keen on personal privacy, you might have come across Brave Browser. Brave is a Chromium-based browser that promises to deliver privacy with built-in ad-blocking and content-blocking protection. It also offers several quality-of-life features and services, like a VPN and Tor access. I mean, it's even listed on the reputable PrivacyTools website. Why am I telling you to steer clear of this browser, then?
Orion all the way
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I prefer either TorBrowser or Waterfox.
TorBrowser is, hands down, the best privacy browser out there but it's a bit slow because it operates like a decentralized VPN.
Waterfox browser is built on Mozilla's Gecko Engine just like firefox, but it isn't managed directly by Mozilla.
Is waterfox compatible with all or most firefox extensions? Also, can you import a firefox profile, and share between devices? I'm fairly invested in firefox, and would hate loosing functionality
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After a significant amount of time. Longer than Brave's blunders. And rehabilitation is not erasure. Likewise, murder enough and society will consider to instead remove the person from society as well instead of rewarding them.
the time can be scarily short and quite rarely ends in life terms in civilized societies
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I prefer either TorBrowser or Waterfox.
TorBrowser is, hands down, the best privacy browser out there but it's a bit slow because it operates like a decentralized VPN.
Waterfox browser is built on Mozilla's Gecko Engine just like firefox, but it isn't managed directly by Mozilla.
I haven't heard of waterfox. I use TorBrowser sometimes. But mostly I use LibreWolf. Its based on Firefox also, but without Monzilla
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Is waterfox compatible with all or most firefox extensions? Also, can you import a firefox profile, and share between devices? I'm fairly invested in firefox, and would hate loosing functionality
I don't use very many extensions, but it works with all of the ones I've tried such as uBlock Origin.
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you know murderers get rehabilitated and released all the time
What rehabilitation have the offending parties on brave gotten beyond amassing wankers who make excuses for them?
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CEO was forcefully ousted from Firefox for anti-LGBTQ views and donations.
I think this is making mountains out of molehills. My understanding is that he had a very good working relationship w/ LGBTQ people in the org, and he had been working for many years at Mozilla before this point. The issue was his private donations to an anti-same sex marriage initiative. He didn't push for any company policy change, didn't advertise the donation, and didn't use company funds (used personal funds), so it really shouldn't be anyone's business.
I personally disagree with his political views, but I think he was a fantastic candidate for CEO of Mozilla. How he votes or spends his personal money shouldn't be relevant at all.
Replaced existing ads on sites with Brave’s own “private” ads.
I like this idea in principle, but not in implementation. Brave should have worked with major websites to share revenue, but what Brave actually did was remove website ads and insert its own, forcing websites to go claim BAT to get any of that revenue back.
My preference here is to not use a cryptocurrency and instead have users pay in their local currency into a bucket to not see ads (and that's shared w/ the website), and that should be in collaboration w/ website owners.
Collected crypto on behalf of others without their knowledge or consent
This is a big nothing-burger.
Basically, Brave had a way to donate to a creator that wasn't affiliated with the creator. The way it works is you could donate (using BAT), and once it got to $100 worth, Brave would reach out to the creator to give them the money. They adjusted the wording to make it clear they weren't affiliated with the creator in any way.
Injected referral links into crypto websites to steal crypto revenue
Yeah, this is totally wrong, and they reversed course immediately.
Put ads in the new page tab
Not a fan, but at least you can opt-out.
Shipped a TOR feature that leaked DNS
Mistakes happen. If you truly need the anonymity, you would have multiple layers of defense (i.e. change your default DNS server) and probably not use something like Brave anyway (Tor Browser is the gold standard here).
Doesn’t disclose the ID of their search engine crawler via useragent
Also a bad move, though I am sympathetic to their reasoning here: they just don't have the resources to get permission from everyone. Search has a huge barrier to entry, and I'm in favor of more competition to Google and Microsoft here.
Removed “strict” fingerprinting protection
This was for better UX, since it broke sites. Not a fan of removing this, they should have instead had a big warning when enabling this (e.g. many sites will break if you enable this).
CEO is generally a right-wing dick.
Fair, but that should be a separate consideration from whether to use a given product. Using Brave doesn't make you a right-wing dick.
You probably wouldn't like the CEO of any company whose products you like, so basing a decision of what product to use based on that is... dumb.
I personally use Brave as a backup browser, for two reasons:
- it's a chrome-based browser
- it has ad-blocking
My primary browser is something based on Firefox because I value rendering-engine competition. But if I need a chromium-based browser, Brave is my go-to. I disable the crypto nonsense and keep ad-blocking on, and it's generally pretty usable.
Using software made by people who are politically aligned to sell out your country to russia is stupid stupid stupid and makes you an idiot, idiot, idiot.
Its not just politics when the politics are treason and electing a kgb asset.
