Donald Trump Pulling US Troops From Europe in Blow to NATO Allies: Report

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we elected the wrong party for that.

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After the door hits them in the arse on their way out, be sure to repatriate all the land for those US bases. Make them pay 300% more for the land, after this term if they want to come back.

And use whatever money is saved to bolster one's own national military. We can't rely on the US any more for defence.

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Yes, but only if the EU doesn't immediately replace the vacuum with their own forces.

(Do any of the EU nations have nukes that aren't owned by the US? Sadly such a deterrent is probably a requirement.)

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I've added some information to my previous comment. Europe might be able to replace the conventional forces, but my concern would be the ICBM defense capabilities. The US MDA has a lot of infrastructure in Europe, and that system has been fantastically expensive to develop and required decades of research and engineering build, and I doubt it can be replaced in less than 20 years.

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Good to know. That's worrying indeed.

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what people don't understand is that europe must say goodbye to america, things are turning.

we (europe) should start considering being more independent (from the USA) and maybe, just maybe, actually talking to our eastern neighbours.

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WW3 will be in 2040, and it will be a civil unrest. workers will be dissatisfied because there's not enough work for them. economic growth on earth is ending, and rather sharply. we must drop our birth rates, because there's no way to keep people in employment after 2040.

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(Do any of the EU nations have nukes that aren't owned by the US? Sadly such a deterrent is probably a requirement.<

European Nations have sufficient Nukes as a deterrent. Well I reckon one nuke plus their warheads would incapacitate most cities. There are like 500-600 officially between UK and France.

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Let me expand a bit on that idea: get the fuck out! Go away.

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Don't let the door hit you on the way out you fucking loser

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Fair enough. The less US military presence in Europe the better. We shouldn't be reliant on the US for our security needs. European and NATO nations need to make sure they're pulling their weight.

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European and NATO nations need to make sure they’re pulling their weight.

Which is something that every President starting with Bill Clinton has been saying but the EU has had its fingers stuck in its ears while going "La la la I can't year you!". They learned nothing from the Yugoslav Wars, didn't wake up for Crimea and it took extreme clanging of the alarm bells to get them to respond to Russo-Ukrainian War.

The EU has more people than the United States with an economy well capable of providing for common defense. It's time for them to quit faffing about and get to it. The US was never supposed to be the eternal linchpin of NATO.

Obligatory: Donald Trump is a cancer.

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That's easier said than done. We have too few people in the military and our equipment is old and sparse.

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our eastern neighbours

... you mean Ukraine, no?

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But then we also withdraw from the Plaza accords.

The Plaza Accord ended in 1987. It was replaced with the Louvre Accord.

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yes also, but not only.

what i'm sick to hear is newspapers calling the ukraininan war an angriffskrieg (war of aggression) while i did not hear that term a single fucking time for the Vietnam war.

(all the while ignoring actual security considerations of russia)

it sickens me that europe fails to see reason. it makes us look weak on an international stage.

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The Vietnam war was 50 years ago. I think there was quite a bit of criticism of the Iraqi invasion which while already a bit dated is a more recent comparison, no?

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yes i was referring to the vietnam one because otherwise people say "muh duh it's because 9/11 and they had to defend themselves".

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Well Vietnam is harder for most people to compare because most of us weren't alive back then. So I don't have a point of reference for how the media treated that conflict.

There's always some kind of flimsy justification for war but we all know that Iraq and 9/11 were in no way related outside of the propaganda. Did people really take those things seriously in your community?

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You aren't wrong but leaving out the bit about how much Europe has benefitted from the USA's military machine is sorta disingenous.

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Donald Trump Pulling US Troops From Europe in Blow to NATO Allies: Report