hexbear.net comically loses its domain name
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A) if you had read my comment closely, you would have seen I said "What they SEE it as. Not what it is
B) Socialism does not require the abolishment of capitalism and most working examples of it, such as in EU countries, works alongside capitalism. This is the version most people think when they reference socialism and that's what's relevant to the discussion.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Socialism
Socialism is an economic and political philosophy encompassing diverse economic and social systems characterised by social ownership of the means of production, as opposed to private ownership. It describes the economic, political, and social theories and movements associated with the implementation of such systems. Social ownership can take various forms, including public, community, collective, cooperative, or employee. As one of the main ideologies on the political spectrum, socialism is the standard left-wing ideology in most countries. Types of socialism vary based on the role of markets and planning in resource allocation, and the structure of management in organizations.
Socialist systems divide into non-market and market forms. A non-market socialist system seeks to eliminate the perceived inefficiencies, irrationalities, unpredictability, and crises that socialists traditionally associate with capital accumulation and the profit system. Market socialism retains the use of monetary prices, factor markets and sometimes the profit motive. As a political force, socialist parties and ideas exercise varying degrees of power and influence, heading national governments in several countries. Socialist politics have been internationalist and nationalist; organised through political parties and opposed to party politics; at times overlapping with trade unions and other times independent and critical of them, and present in industrialised and developing nations. Social democracy originated within the socialist movement, supporting economic and social interventions to promote social justice. While retaining socialism as a long-term goal, in the post-war period social democracy embraced a mixed economy based on Keynesianism within a predominantly developed capitalist market economy and liberal democratic polity that expands state intervention to include income redistribution, regulation, and a welfare state.
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China is calling the state capitalism they have there "Socialism with Chinese characteristics". Hence "with Dessalines characteristics".
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The very first sentence of the Wiki entry invalidates your argument that EU countries are socialist. They’re not even working toward socialism, because they’re not working toward abolishing private ownership of the means of production. In fact they’ve all been moving in the opposite direction ever since Margaret Thatcher. They’ve been privatizing things that had been public.
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I bid seventy cents, two peanut shells, and a cancelled postage stamp.
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Ok neolib
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No no no, see, DNS is bad, that's the whole point. No touchy.
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I get what you're saying about the technical definition, but when most people talk about 'socialism' today, they're thinking of the European model of strong social programs and regulated capitalism - aka social democracy. That's the common usage I was working with. Could I have been more precise with terminology? Sure.
But that doesn't change my main point about tankies, they reject even that moderate approach in favor of turning the dial to 11 and pushing authoritarian systems like China's at the sacrifice of human rights and freedoms (and overlooking/denying them when said regimes do it), which is exactly what I was criticizing.
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Its generic slop by anime standards. Like yeah anime is meant for teenagers and young adults so you can't be too critical over fanservice or flat YA novel Gary sue tier character writing or forgetting to write an actually compelling reason for the villian trapping them in the digital world by he time its over.
Anime in general is not meant to be high art but SAO goes the extra mile to be uninteresting bland slop that appeals to the lowest common denominator. The isekai genre has done a lot better over the decade since SAO initially released things like rezero blow it out if the water in terms of actually interesting plot and suspense.
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An unhealthy Lemmy obsession.
Just block it and get on with your life.
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Don't get me wrong - I certainly earn most of the downvotes I get. That was just a weird one that caught me off-guard. It is as you say.
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Ah, I get you now lol
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The Western capitalist states just did a twenty year long “war on terror” based on lies, causing the deaths of millions, and are complicit in
supporting a 15 month long genocide of Palestinians, and you’re super-concerned about China’s human rights abuses as reported by those same Western states, which are virulently anti-communist and known to push BS anti-communist narratives for the last century?Neither Washington nor Beijing, but actually Washington.
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The difference nobody's denying (well I'm sure the right-wing nut jobs anyways) it.
And also now you've just devolved into the classic tankie "whataboutism" as if what the West does at all excuses what China/Russia are doing.
The censorship and suppression of freedoms in China are well documented.
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Oh right. When I first heard about Lemmy, I tried to join .ml because it was the first instance I was made aware of. I think it was being rate limited at the time due to that whole reddit exodus thing, and I wasn't able to get through, but. .world let me sign up so here I am.
I'd like to think that members of a given instance have their own opinions. It's sad to hear about how territorial lemmy is.
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It's sad to hear about how territorial lemmy is.
Not really territorial, more... despises authoritarianism in all its forms lol.
While I'm sure there are plenty of non-tankie .ml users, the problem is with the admins and mods being the biggest Tankies around who enforce the "Tankie ideology" throughout.
Go checkout .ml memes, anything posted that's Tankie-like will even sometimes get tons of downvotes as the post gets federated to non-Tankie instances but never removed.
Conversely, anything posted that's even slightly critical of China/Russia is quickly removed under the catch-all "Rule 1 bigotry" (You'll have to check the modlog for that)
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Socialism is the theory that workers should own the means of production. Communism is the theory that the workers should massacre the owners in order to get them. While socialism describes an ideal state of society, communism is explicitly a program for mass murder to achieve a much more vague definition of an ideal society. That is why, after establishing a communist state, communist governments continue to seek out and purge or murder heretics against the Marxist-Leninist state ideology (or "Mao Zedong thought"). Communism is not a theory, as dialectical materialism likes to pretend it is. At its best, communism is a political cult that attract white middle class college freshman. At its worst, communism is a state religion with all the inquisitions and mass murder and auto-genocide that comes with that.
Communism is unintelligible without perceived enemies of the working class. This was not a perversion by Lenin or Stalin; this is baked into the DNA of the writings of Marx, who dedicated a few thousand pages to misdescribing the economics of capitalism and his fantasies for mass murder, but comparatively few pages describing what the end result of that revolution looks like.
I can intellectually respect a Socialist who is convinced that the world would be better if all companies were worker coops, or if all business were regulated by state councils of proletarian soviets. I do not respect anybody claiming to be a communist in precisely the same way that I don't respect anyone claiming to be a Nazi; they are equally evil and murderous ideologies that are responsible for tens if not over a hundred million deaths throughout the 20th century. Anybody who endorses this ideology in the 21st century is as low as a fucking neo-Nazi
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They don’t care, mission was accomplished in November of last year.
