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  3. Tutanota / Mailbox.org?

Tutanota / Mailbox.org?

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  • drkt@scribe.disroot.orgD [email protected]

    Every once in a while they'll send you an email with special CSS styling so you can't avoid seeing it and you can't unsubscribe from it. They call it a newsletter. It's advertising. It's less news and more begging you to buy more of their stuff. Very occasionally they'll bump new features onto a higher tier but still show that feature in your UI, with special CSS styling. God forbid if they try to upgrade your account but you deny because you're happy with the features you have now and the amount you pay; they push harder and harder the longer you're on a 'legacy' tier.

    It happened to me. It'll happen to you.

    D This user is from outside of this forum
    D This user is from outside of this forum
    [email protected]
    wrote on last edited by
    #23

    special CSS styling so you can’t avoid seeing it

    you can't set your client to plain-text only?

    drkt@scribe.disroot.orgD 1 Reply Last reply
    0
    • ? Guest

      Huge beginner here, but privacytools.io says Mailbox is encrypted? Is it the "end to end" part? How did you find out they're not?
      https://www.privacytools.io/privacy-email

      C This user is from outside of this forum
      C This user is from outside of this forum
      [email protected]
      wrote on last edited by
      #24

      Mailbox encrypts the email at rest on their servers but with the encryption keys they own. Protonmail, in contrast, uses zero access encryption where they encrypt your data with your public key and they do not know or have access to your private key to be able to decrypt the data even if they wanted to.

      Mailbox has a zero access encryption service called (I think) Guard that basically encrypts the email with PGP where they would no longer be able to decrypt your email. But it’s not enabled by default.

      E 1 Reply Last reply
      0
      • ? Guest

        People not talking about Startmail or Disroot. Not good options?

        iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI This user is from outside of this forum
        iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI This user is from outside of this forum
        [email protected]
        wrote on last edited by
        #25

        I'm all for options, to be honest. What ideally I'd like is some sort of good encrypted email based in some safe European country, which can achieve decent Android integration. Proton apps are pretty useless to that effect (lack of offline basic functionalities, the calendar app isn't even an android calendar provider).
        I'm not too hard in moving around my emails, since for the last few years I've been giving my email @duck.com which actually ends up sending to my final email after some tracking cleaning. Changing email provider would entail only updating my @duck.com destination.

        R 1 Reply Last reply
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        • C [email protected]

          It's not on your list but I've had a Mailfence email for the last couple of years and they've been solid.

          You could also use YUNOhost to host your own on a VPS. I had no experience before setting mine up and it was fine. Unlimited email accounts and aliases out of the box, plus you can host other stuff besides, like a website, file server or even a fediverse instance.

          iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI This user is from outside of this forum
          iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI This user is from outside of this forum
          [email protected]
          wrote on last edited by
          #26

          I'd try avoiding email hosting. I've heard way too many times that it's too much pain when it fails, and when it fails basically emails are bounced. I can't afford to miss taxes emails or other important stuff.

          1 Reply Last reply
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          • M [email protected]

            Didn't know Mailbox had a free tier! Gotta check that out.

            iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI This user is from outside of this forum
            iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI This user is from outside of this forum
            [email protected]
            wrote on last edited by
            #27

            For what's worth, I'm going to give it a shot on the month trial. But I already see the middle tier for 3€ offers 10GB email only. I think I can fit my current old mail backup in about 4GB, but it would be slightly tight, I guess. I'm on an older Proton plan which charges about 3USD per month (by-yearly) and it gets me about 20GB. I think shared between cloud and email (I'm not actually interested in the cloud part, I have Seafile for that).

            1 Reply Last reply
            0
            • ? Guest

              However, mailbox can still be encrypted with pgp, and has some built in supports which make this easier.

              One problem I had with proton/tuta is that you cannot use a third party app due to the encryption, which you can with mailbox. A problem I have with mailbox is that it does not support fido2 for login or 2fa, which could be a security concern.

              iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI This user is from outside of this forum
              iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI This user is from outside of this forum
              [email protected]
              wrote on last edited by
              #28

              Thanks, these are the kind of valid points I'm looking for. I noticed the lack of 2fa when I was registering for the demo, they only asked for a backup email or a phone number...neither too privacy-friendly there. But I guess I can live with that.

              1 Reply Last reply
              0
              • C [email protected]

                As far as I’m aware, there is a huge difference between these three in that Mailbox.org is not end-to-end encrypted. So if that is an important feature for your use case, that may disqualify them from your options.

                D This user is from outside of this forum
                D This user is from outside of this forum
                [email protected]
                wrote on last edited by
                #29

                Email is never "end to end encrypted" outside of layering something else on like PGP- which you could use with any email service.

                C 1 Reply Last reply
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                • I [email protected]

                  we encrypy our stuff for you, trust us bro

                  Their clients are open source. Might not be "standard" like PGP, but if you could read code, you could verify that it's encrypted before it gets sent.

                  engineergaming@feddit.nlE This user is from outside of this forum
                  engineergaming@feddit.nlE This user is from outside of this forum
                  [email protected]
                  wrote on last edited by
                  #30

                  Wouldn't that be only between Tutanota users anyway? Sure, you could use PGP manually, but it is more annoying, I prefer the seamlessness of doing so in my client. Not to mention not having an option if you, say, don't like the UI!

                  perishthethought@lemm.eeP 1 Reply Last reply
                  0
                  • D [email protected]

                    special CSS styling so you can’t avoid seeing it

                    you can't set your client to plain-text only?

                    drkt@scribe.disroot.orgD This user is from outside of this forum
                    drkt@scribe.disroot.orgD This user is from outside of this forum
                    [email protected]
                    wrote on last edited by
                    #31

                    Tuta does not have a text-only mode for it's interface.

                    1 Reply Last reply
                    0
                    • D [email protected]

                      Email is never "end to end encrypted" outside of layering something else on like PGP- which you could use with any email service.

                      C This user is from outside of this forum
                      C This user is from outside of this forum
                      [email protected]
                      wrote on last edited by
                      #32

                      It is under certain circumstances. Specific to ProtonMail, it is E2E encrypted if you send a message to another ProtonMail user. They also have a feature where you can send an encrypted email to an outside address. I think in that case the recipient gets a link where they can then input the decryption password to read the message.

                      But you’re right about any email you receive (from a non-ProtonMail address). Those can not be E2E encrypted and are only stored encrypted at rest.

                      E 1 Reply Last reply
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                      • iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI [email protected]

                        Hi guys!

                        I'm looking for a Proton alternative. So far I've seen these two recommended. I was wondering what are the pros/cons of each? Seems Tutanota offers more bang for the buck in mailbox size etc, but I'm not sure. I'd also like to have a better integration with Android, because Proton's email/calendar apps suck big time.

                        Thanks!

                        N This user is from outside of this forum
                        N This user is from outside of this forum
                        [email protected]
                        wrote on last edited by
                        #33

                        Take a look into Posteo if having a custom domain is something you can live without.

                        iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI 1 Reply Last reply
                        0
                        • N [email protected]

                          Take a look into Posteo if having a custom domain is something you can live without.

                          iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI This user is from outside of this forum
                          iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI This user is from outside of this forum
                          [email protected]
                          wrote on last edited by
                          #34

                          Posteo
                          Wow...This one seems to be a very good one as well. How come it's not even mentioned in privacytools.io or privacyguides.org?

                          P N 2 Replies Last reply
                          0
                          • iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI [email protected]

                            Posteo
                            Wow...This one seems to be a very good one as well. How come it's not even mentioned in privacytools.io or privacyguides.org?

                            P This user is from outside of this forum
                            P This user is from outside of this forum
                            [email protected]
                            wrote on last edited by
                            #35

                            You also get SMTP with posteo, if that is important to you.

                            iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI 1 Reply Last reply
                            0
                            • iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI [email protected]

                              Posteo
                              Wow...This one seems to be a very good one as well. How come it's not even mentioned in privacytools.io or privacyguides.org?

                              N This user is from outside of this forum
                              N This user is from outside of this forum
                              [email protected]
                              wrote on last edited by
                              #36

                              Not sure.

                              It's not as popular, but i use it with my own PGP keys & Thunderbird and it's great!

                              1 Reply Last reply
                              0
                              • drkt@scribe.disroot.orgD [email protected]

                                Every once in a while they'll send you an email with special CSS styling so you can't avoid seeing it and you can't unsubscribe from it. They call it a newsletter. It's advertising. It's less news and more begging you to buy more of their stuff. Very occasionally they'll bump new features onto a higher tier but still show that feature in your UI, with special CSS styling. God forbid if they try to upgrade your account but you deny because you're happy with the features you have now and the amount you pay; they push harder and harder the longer you're on a 'legacy' tier.

                                It happened to me. It'll happen to you.

                                jherazob@beehaw.orgJ This user is from outside of this forum
                                jherazob@beehaw.orgJ This user is from outside of this forum
                                [email protected]
                                wrote on last edited by
                                #37

                                The GDPR ensures there's no mailing list you cannot unsubscribe from, if they won't let you it's not a good thing

                                1 Reply Last reply
                                0
                                • P [email protected]

                                  You also get SMTP with posteo, if that is important to you.

                                  iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI This user is from outside of this forum
                                  iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI This user is from outside of this forum
                                  [email protected]
                                  wrote on last edited by
                                  #38

                                  With that you mean it's standard access IMAP/SMTP from any client you want, as opposed to Proton/Tutanota and their custom apps right? Yeah, I prefer a standard protocol and my own app.

                                  P 1 Reply Last reply
                                  0
                                  • iturnedintoanewt@lemm.eeI [email protected]

                                    Hi guys!

                                    I'm looking for a Proton alternative. So far I've seen these two recommended. I was wondering what are the pros/cons of each? Seems Tutanota offers more bang for the buck in mailbox size etc, but I'm not sure. I'd also like to have a better integration with Android, because Proton's email/calendar apps suck big time.

                                    Thanks!

                                    O This user is from outside of this forum
                                    O This user is from outside of this forum
                                    [email protected]
                                    wrote on last edited by
                                    #39

                                    Posteo rocks.

                                    E 1 Reply Last reply
                                    0
                                    • ? Guest

                                      People not talking about Startmail or Disroot. Not good options?

                                      E This user is from outside of this forum
                                      E This user is from outside of this forum
                                      [email protected]
                                      wrote on last edited by
                                      #40

                                      Disroot is fine

                                      1 Reply Last reply
                                      0
                                      • C [email protected]

                                        It is under certain circumstances. Specific to ProtonMail, it is E2E encrypted if you send a message to another ProtonMail user. They also have a feature where you can send an encrypted email to an outside address. I think in that case the recipient gets a link where they can then input the decryption password to read the message.

                                        But you’re right about any email you receive (from a non-ProtonMail address). Those can not be E2E encrypted and are only stored encrypted at rest.

                                        E This user is from outside of this forum
                                        E This user is from outside of this forum
                                        [email protected]
                                        wrote on last edited by
                                        #41

                                        Protonmail uses pgp under the hood. Their encryption was only ever within proton accounts because they had an automatic key lookup system. You can of course add your own keys, but most didn't. Still pgp.

                                        1 Reply Last reply
                                        0
                                        • C [email protected]

                                          Mailbox encrypts the email at rest on their servers but with the encryption keys they own. Protonmail, in contrast, uses zero access encryption where they encrypt your data with your public key and they do not know or have access to your private key to be able to decrypt the data even if they wanted to.

                                          Mailbox has a zero access encryption service called (I think) Guard that basically encrypts the email with PGP where they would no longer be able to decrypt your email. But it’s not enabled by default.

                                          E This user is from outside of this forum
                                          E This user is from outside of this forum
                                          [email protected]
                                          wrote on last edited by
                                          #42

                                          That's true once it's received, but it's still processed by proton and now we know they are pro-nazi so who knows what they would do.

                                          You can avoid this with pgp as stated (default for proton to proton messages), but I don't think it's worth considering the at rest encryption at proton anymore.

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