They're literally conspiring against you
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where it ends up making the clothes fit poorly
a.k.a makes the clothes fit anything but skin-tight because the pockets need space so the clothes have to be wider-cut
That seems like an oversimplification, outside looking in for me, but there's no way a single dimension could ever adequately describe an item of clothing - my sister and wife have similar sized waists, but something tight round the posterior on my wife would be baggy on my sister.
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And then imagine how it feels like to shop for clothes if your body doesn't even conform to the expected average norms.
I god damn hate it. Stuff is either too wide or too short, the sleeves are NEVER long enough, the only available shoes that fit and don't feel like torture are jogging shoes or sneakers, the neck width is never sufficient (unless you buy men's clothes, which will look like a tent because tits weren't part of the equasion)…
Uuugh, I hate shopping for clothes. -.-
You might want to look into barefoot shoes. They're designed to have a really thin sole so you're basically walking barefoot. I had trouble finding shoes that fit until I switched. It also just feels good to be actually using my feet "properly". Instead of relying on the shoe to bend in certain ways, it's my foot and the muscles in my foot that are doing the work.
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We all know that the rich wear personally tailored suits and so-on. But, what I think would be amazing is to be rich enough to wear a personally tailored t-shirt, or personally tailored socks. For women, I can't imagine the joy of having a personally tailored bra that was built precisely to fit their exact body. That must exist at some level of wealth, but I just wonder how rich you have to be to justify that kind of spending.
For most people, even when you find something that fits well, there are going to be compromises, like the shoulders might fit perfectly, but it's just a bit too long, or a bit too tight. But, just imagine something simple like a T-shirt where instead of "medium" you get something that takes into account your torso's length, your ribcage's size, your shoulder's width, your arm's circumference, the size of your neck, and so-on.
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I know this is a problem, as I see my wife deal with it frequently.
But understand that men's sizes aren't consistent either. I have a 32" waist...maybe. Some jeans and shorts fit me perfectly, some are way too tight, and some are way too loose. Even within the same brand and product. The jeans I have on today are pretty good for fit. A different pair of jeans I was wearing a few days ago required regular adjustments to keep from falling down. My weight hasn't varied THAT much.
The situation for men isn't as bad as women's sizes, though. I'd love to know how they think they can compress all of the different measurements a woman's body can have into a single number. At least they haven't tried that with men - for example, pants are waist and inseam length, so you can usually get what you need, or at least pretty close (notwithstanding the above issue). If they condensed that into one number, I have no idea how that would work.
I'm a size M guy, everything from head to toe is M. If M doesn't fit, I will try S, but most of the time that is too small, so I just skip that fit or brand. Sometimes the size difference is so ridiculous it might as well be two different shirts. One time I tried a polo in M and it looked like an oversized 90s hip‑hop shirt on me so I tried the S and it was so tight it looked like swimwear lol.
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It's less extreme but men's clothing is like this too. I found a cut of jeans I liked in a store then ordered 4 mor pairs in different colors. None fit the same and 2 were unwearable.
I did the same! It was not jeans but pants that is supposed to look like they are a bit more formal but are more comfortable. From the website did I just pick 3 different colors of the same size but they all fit so differently, and one pair had much thicker fabric, felt more like they went "close enough" and called it a day lol
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At this point I'm wondering if the designers just roll dice and put the result on the label.
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Always get a size up and wash them hot to shrink to you
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Ha, my point was more that the bandsaw wasn't tracking straight so all the blanks on the bottom are bigger, the seamstress runs a hem 10mm (more or less) from the edge so the dimension remains out and the QA guy couldn't give a fuck because it's 8:30 on a Friday night and he's been working 21 days straight.
Even the same garment is going to have a different size in different countries, large in Italy, medium in UK etc etc. the real size is somewhere in between, but no one makes that level of granularity.
You should watch some of these garments being made, it's mind blowing.
Cutting blanks and this is a tame/slow process Vs some other factories I've seen on the tube.
See, regional differences that i can fix with a conversion chart im fine with. That's just more sizes. As long as they're printed.
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We all know that the rich wear personally tailored suits and so-on. But, what I think would be amazing is to be rich enough to wear a personally tailored t-shirt, or personally tailored socks. For women, I can't imagine the joy of having a personally tailored bra that was built precisely to fit their exact body. That must exist at some level of wealth, but I just wonder how rich you have to be to justify that kind of spending.
For most people, even when you find something that fits well, there are going to be compromises, like the shoulders might fit perfectly, but it's just a bit too long, or a bit too tight. But, just imagine something simple like a T-shirt where instead of "medium" you get something that takes into account your torso's length, your ribcage's size, your shoulder's width, your arm's circumference, the size of your neck, and so-on.
Tailors are pretty affordable. Anyone can take clothes into a tailor and get them tailored to their body shape. Idk if bras are able to be adjusted though.
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This isn't just a problem with women's jeans which have arbitrary size numbers. Even men's jeans which are size by the actual waist and inseam measurement can be wrong. In addition to vanity sizing, cheaper jeans are also made from larger material cuts out of the patterns at the same time to save manufacturing cost sometimes twice as many as shown here:
Those at the top or bottom of the stack may end up a bit smaller or a bit larger than the pattern, but they all get marked with the same size.
Whether it was this manufacturing problem or vanity sizing, this is why I stopped buying Old Navy jeans. I could pick out 3 jeans all labeled with the same size and one would fit okay, one would be too small, and one too large. I have never had this problem with Eddie Bauer jeans.
Edit: I found picture showing the larger stacks (which can introduce the mismatched sizing) I was referring to:
Is that then called a jeack?
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I wear size 34 cargo shorts.
There is no point near my waist that is even close to a tape measured 34 inches.
Its been a long time since I've actually been measured but I must be somewhere between 32 and 38 inches based on the pants in my closet. My 36/34 jeans fit the best. I have to wear a belt but they aren't so loose that they immediately hit the ground without on. I picked up a 34/34 pair. Same cut, wash, and color and they are wearable but they're tight at the waste and crush my balls a little when I sit. The inseam must be at least an inch shorter than the first pair.
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We're getting jackets as a christmas present from my employer and they had us fill out a size form. "Sizes are as usual."
Made me think of this.
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Yeah as a trans woman it was bittersweet when my hips stopped fitting in men's jeans. They're sturdier with bigger pockets and way more (but not really) consistently sized.
The problem in men's sizes is tolerances in fabric cutting as they stack more and more sheets per cut. Women's clothes do that while also playing calvinball.
All this means rhat as a long legged skinny girl with thick thighs, biker's calves, and an ass I'd only trade while pant shopping, pant shopping is a long pain in the ass.
Big and Tall brands don't give waistband sizes often anymore in my experience. They just add xs to ls now
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I wear size 34 cargo shorts.
There is no point near my waist that is even close to a tape measured 34 inches.
The wonder of "relaxed fit"
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Tailors are pretty affordable. Anyone can take clothes into a tailor and get them tailored to their body shape. Idk if bras are able to be adjusted though.
Sure, tailors are affordable, but can anybody really justify spending $80 for a tailored T-shirt? If you're a multi-millionaire maybe you can, and maybe your T-shirts feel absolutely great as a result.
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Not just a women problem, my own jeans are 32. My workout pants are M, my work pants are size 50.
Shoes should be standardized, i have pair of converse size 39 and a pair of nike jordan's (possibly fake, not sure got them as a gift from a friend) size 44. I'm usually a 42 or 42,5.
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Just buy in Temu, they put these BS sizes but there's always a chart in cm so if you know your numbers you get it right.
Same thing when I wanted Business shirts. Where I live it's all s m l bulshit. I went to Macy's online and they sell most brands by 3 measures I think, can't remember, it's collar size, arm length in inches. Well worth the international shipping fees for a week's worth of shirts. Now I mostly work from home, I think they'll last until I retire lol
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I didn't even know they had gay sizes.
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Sure, tailors are affordable, but can anybody really justify spending $80 for a tailored T-shirt? If you're a multi-millionaire maybe you can, and maybe your T-shirts feel absolutely great as a result.
Its less than $20 and normally done on dresses, jackets, pants.
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Yes, but men's clothes come with the other issues, too. I just started sewing my own pants because I couldn't find a pair that was in the right spot between good fit and style, affordability, quality and not being made under exploitive labour conditions.
While that's certainly true, I don't think that doesn't apply to women's clothing as well nor does it change that women's clothing not having pockets is kinda bullshit, even though you can technically add your own after the fact.
It would be more of a "yes, but..." Situation if women's clothing that didn't have pockets always fit perfectly and hit all the criteria you mentioned. They have that problem and they don't get pockets.
