Audiologists raise concern over headphone use in young people
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Because that worked so well for
Dr.WakefieldNot at all the same thing. There was tons of evidence and theory that vaccines were safe, and the consequences of not using them were very high.
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Yeah, ANC quality can vary a lot and generally it's even worse for earbuds.
I have a pair of Bose QC Ultra headphones which have amazing ANC.
A few month back there was a constuction site across the street. At one point I felt my desk vibrating, so I took of my headphones ... only then did I realised they were using a jackhammer.
Similar story here, Bose QC whilst the house next door was (basically) being demolished... I just found the headphones ate batteries faster.
I sometimes find I'm just working with the headphones on and whatever I was listening to had stopped ages ago.
by blocking everyday sounds such as cars beeping, there is a possibility the brain can "forget" to filter out the noise.
Also growing up in the quiet countryside, I can say that you do not “forget” to hear sounds like cars... it's definitely the everyday background noise that's the problem.
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There was never even a shred of proper science behind the autism causes vaccines thing, and it was a very very very very minority opinion.
Does gravity exist on Alpha Centrauri? Ask any physicist, they're going to say "yes". You're then going to stand there, saying "we have not actually made the necessary experiments on Alpha Centauri itself, we do not have conclusive evidence, all those people are peddling pseudoscience". Never mind that all that we know about physics leads us to the extrapolation that, yes, gravity exists there and we have no reason to think why there isn't gravity there. Could that extrapolation be wrong? Yes. But it's also a silly thing to insist onto working into the plans of a colonialisation spaceship. All you're achieving with that is having it never be built, bogging shit down in unsubstantiated scepticism.
You are right there's never been any credible evidence.
But I wasn't claiming that.
I was claiming it was irresponsible to report on such an early finding in the media without proper verification and actual conclusive studies.
Almost like the BBC article here in question.
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Not at all the same thing. There was tons of evidence and theory that vaccines were safe, and the consequences of not using them were very high.
And yet that didn't stop the ACTUAL harm it caused.
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Tbh this just sounds like ADHD or something.
It's APD (Auditory Processing Disorder). That's explained in the article.
Guess I didn't read that far
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The cause of Sophie's APD diagnosis is unknown, but her audiologist believes the overuse of noise-cancelling headphones, which Sophie wears for up to five hours a day, could have a part to play.
So fucking stupid...
Kid grew up on a quiet farm in the countryside, then she moved to London and probably 100+ student plus lectures.
It's not that noise cancelling headphones prevented her from developing normally, she developed in an environment like what we evolved to handle.
Then she got thrown into a cacophony of sound that is one of the planets largest/busiest cities...
And they act like she is the problem and not noise pollution?
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41370-024-00642-5
Noise pollution is fucking a lot of us up, and people who grew up with it are used to it, but that doesn't stop the negative consequences of it. Someone that never had to deal with it is obviously going to have what looks like a sudden onset of a condition, but the person is fine.
The environment is the problem.
People are posting about wanting to run away to the woods but I think it's important to remember that cities can be quiet.
Not that we should all move to Delft, but if we built infrastructure for people instead of cars cities wouldn't be so fucking loud.
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You are right there's never been any credible evidence.
But I wasn't claiming that.
I was claiming it was irresponsible to report on such an early finding in the media without proper verification and actual conclusive studies.
Almost like the BBC article here in question.
They're reporting on what the audiologists observe and believe to be the case, and clearly label it as such: A belief, with further study necessary. People thinking they could be affected by this might take action after reading the article, true, and the action would be -- easing off on using sound-cancelling headphones. That could, in the end, not help. What would be the harm done? Neither the science was misrepresented, it was portrayed as incomplete, "here's our educated guess", and the recommendations one can draw from that guess are quite inconceivable to cause harm themselves.
Have a look again at what the Hippocratic oath states: First, do no harm. They're keeping to that. Ease off. You can tell a patient to try dialling back on their coffee consumption before having conclusive proof that that's what's causing their jitters: Less coffee won't kill them.
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They're reporting on what the audiologists observe and believe to be the case, and clearly label it as such: A belief, with further study necessary. People thinking they could be affected by this might take action after reading the article, true, and the action would be -- easing off on using sound-cancelling headphones. That could, in the end, not help. What would be the harm done? Neither the science was misrepresented, it was portrayed as incomplete, "here's our educated guess", and the recommendations one can draw from that guess are quite inconceivable to cause harm themselves.
Have a look again at what the Hippocratic oath states: First, do no harm. They're keeping to that. Ease off. You can tell a patient to try dialling back on their coffee consumption before having conclusive proof that that's what's causing their jitters: Less coffee won't kill them.
You say this like pilots, young and old, haven't been using ANC headphones for decades safely at this point.
And no, just because someone says something could be a risk, doesn't mean we all respond. I mean that's literally the lesson we learned from the vacines cause autism. What are you even talking about it's okay to just wildly speculate.
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You say this like pilots, young and old, haven't been using ANC headphones for decades safely at this point.
And no, just because someone says something could be a risk, doesn't mean we all respond. I mean that's literally the lesson we learned from the vacines cause autism. What are you even talking about it's okay to just wildly speculate.
There's a marked difference between using headphones to cancel out deafening noises while you're working, and using them all the time to get rid of everyday noise. There's also a clear difference in age, once you're a pilot and start wearing those things you're fully grown, while the affected here are quite younger, having used those headphones extensively while their brains are still way more plastic.
"Noise-cancelling is dangerous in general" is something you read into the article. It's not actually there. What it's saying is "young people should watch their use of noise-cancelling headphones as the auditory system needs exposure to noise to properly develop". That's it. It's a "young people, have an eye on this" thing, not "burn your headphones".
What are you even talking about it’s okay to just wildly speculate.
I said no such thing. Here's a wild speculation: You have noise-cancelling headphones and somehow interpret the article as a personal attack. Ok that wasn't wild it has actually some basis. This is wild: You're an alien from Alpha Cenauri trying to sow misinformation about the existence of zero-gravity space in your solar system. I'm Schizotypal, dare me, I can go on all day like that if you want to.
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There's a marked difference between using headphones to cancel out deafening noises while you're working, and using them all the time to get rid of everyday noise. There's also a clear difference in age, once you're a pilot and start wearing those things you're fully grown, while the affected here are quite younger, having used those headphones extensively while their brains are still way more plastic.
"Noise-cancelling is dangerous in general" is something you read into the article. It's not actually there. What it's saying is "young people should watch their use of noise-cancelling headphones as the auditory system needs exposure to noise to properly develop". That's it. It's a "young people, have an eye on this" thing, not "burn your headphones".
What are you even talking about it’s okay to just wildly speculate.
I said no such thing. Here's a wild speculation: You have noise-cancelling headphones and somehow interpret the article as a personal attack. Ok that wasn't wild it has actually some basis. This is wild: You're an alien from Alpha Cenauri trying to sow misinformation about the existence of zero-gravity space in your solar system. I'm Schizotypal, dare me, I can go on all day like that if you want to.
Fun fact. In North America you can get your pilots license at 16 in Canada and I believe the US, and yet there's been nothing reported there? So nope still don't buy it.
And where do you think ANC tech was developed? Bose literally made their name in aviation headsets.
"Noise-cancelling is dangerous in general" is something you read into the article. It's not actually there. What it's saying is "young people should watch their use of noise-cancelling headphones as the auditory system needs exposure to noise to properly develop". That's it. It's a "young people, have an eye on this" thing, not "burn your headphones".
Your still listening to someone just shouting into a microphone. Why should I take them seriously?
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APD doesn't have similarities with ADHD. ADHD can cause APD but APD like many other common symptoms is not in the official catalog of symptoms for ADHD. But it makes sense when you think of ADHD as "not being able to prioritize input" so all you hear is processed simultaneously.
I'm not saying the doctors are wrong. But they don't know why she has it and I'm just saying that there may be a link that they're not seeing because of years of wrong diagnosis criteria for ADHD and Autism. Hell until 2013 they told that it is impossible to have both and today we know that the overlap is somewhere between 30 and 50%.
APD doesn’t have similarities with ADHD. ADHD can cause APD but APD like many other common symptoms is not in the official catalog of symptoms for ADHD.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/9493945/
"Central auditory processing disorder (CAPD) and attention deficit hyperactivity disorder (ADHD) present overlapping symptomatology."
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I'm wondering if the cause and effect are the other way around, people that have trouble with noise (such as people with APD) might want noise cancelling headphones. The rise in cases of APD might indicate otherwise, but with the information provided, it sounds like it might be under-diagnosed anyway.
The first thing many people used to assume is that if you had any problems with listening, you might be somewhat deaf. APD and other difficulties listening definitely aren't deafness, but I wonder if there is increased awareness of other reasons why someone might have difficulty understanding speech.
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People with APD now have access to ANC headphones and are thus using them.
I had APD in the 70s and I have it now.
Difference is that i have ANC headphones now and can get them to block out what my brain won't.Like the rise in ADHD and Autism diagnosis... There isn't more cases, just diagnosis got better or more available.
Correlation not causation.
Idiots.
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I kinda regard ANC and smart watches as pacifiers for adults. The real world is only going to hurt more the longer you stay attached to the teat.
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People with APD now have access to ANC headphones and are thus using them.
I had APD in the 70s and I have it now.
Difference is that i have ANC headphones now and can get them to block out what my brain won't.Like the rise in ADHD and Autism diagnosis... There isn't more cases, just diagnosis got better or more available.
Correlation not causation.
Idiots.
Like the rise in ADHD and Autism diagnosis... There isn't more cases, just diagnosis got better or more available.
It's both.
We're finding that even things like microplastics are causing changes that's not fully understood. There's even a recent study that links an increase in histamine to worsened ADHD symptoms.
And then there are things like poor sleep hygiene when very young can trigger a development of ADHD later on.
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Like the rise in ADHD and Autism diagnosis... There isn't more cases, just diagnosis got better or more available.
It's both.
We're finding that even things like microplastics are causing changes that's not fully understood. There's even a recent study that links an increase in histamine to worsened ADHD symptoms.
And then there are things like poor sleep hygiene when very young can trigger a development of ADHD later on.
And then there are things like poor sleep hygiene when very young
can trigger acorrelates with the development of ADHD later on.FTFY. Correlation≠Causation, especially in cases like you mentioned. It’s a chicken and egg scenario.
Are kids getting ADHD because they didn’t sleep well? Or is poor sleep hygiene an early indicator of ADHD? Lots of people with ADHD have poor sleep hygiene, even as adults. Many will struggle with things like Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome, because they get their biggest bursts of focus late at night when everyone else is asleep, the brain is releasing dopamine to keep them awake, and distractions are limited. Every single adult with ADHD has stories about getting focused on a project right before bedtime, then suddenly realizing the birds are chirping outside their window and the sun is rising.
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And then there are things like poor sleep hygiene when very young
can trigger acorrelates with the development of ADHD later on.FTFY. Correlation≠Causation, especially in cases like you mentioned. It’s a chicken and egg scenario.
Are kids getting ADHD because they didn’t sleep well? Or is poor sleep hygiene an early indicator of ADHD? Lots of people with ADHD have poor sleep hygiene, even as adults. Many will struggle with things like Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome, because they get their biggest bursts of focus late at night when everyone else is asleep, the brain is releasing dopamine to keep them awake, and distractions are limited. Every single adult with ADHD has stories about getting focused on a project right before bedtime, then suddenly realizing the birds are chirping outside their window and the sun is rising.
this is so me, lolSome Linux and some DnB and the night is gone
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I kinda regard ANC and smart watches as pacifiers for adults. The real world is only going to hurt more the longer you stay attached to the teat.
Do you feel the same about other wearable tech, like clothes and shoes?
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Do you feel the same about other wearable tech, like clothes and shoes?
A bit with shoes if worn all the time. They destroy your arches, toe splay, and hip alignment with your spine. And you become dependant because your feet get so soft and sensitive. Plus people drag those dirty things all over their homes.
Calling shoes and clothes wearable tech is quite a stretch. Particularly compared to smart watches and headphones. Why did you make that false equivalence?
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And then there are things like poor sleep hygiene when very young
can trigger acorrelates with the development of ADHD later on.FTFY. Correlation≠Causation, especially in cases like you mentioned. It’s a chicken and egg scenario.
Are kids getting ADHD because they didn’t sleep well? Or is poor sleep hygiene an early indicator of ADHD? Lots of people with ADHD have poor sleep hygiene, even as adults. Many will struggle with things like Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome, because they get their biggest bursts of focus late at night when everyone else is asleep, the brain is releasing dopamine to keep them awake, and distractions are limited. Every single adult with ADHD has stories about getting focused on a project right before bedtime, then suddenly realizing the birds are chirping outside their window and the sun is rising.
Are
kidspeople getting ADHD because they didn’t sleep well? Or is poor sleep hygiene an early indicator of ADHD?The research shows that poor sleep hygiene can be a trigger for ADHD related symptoms. Poor sleep hygiene is not the same as "didn't sleep well". Poor sleep hygiene is not going to bed at an appropriate time, going to bed at wildly different times each night, blue light exposure within 2 hours of bedtime, etc.
The ages of 0 - 4 years are the most crucial for brain development. It's why newborns sleep several times a day. The brain hasn't finished forming by the time they are born. Even at the age of 3, kids are still napping mid-day. And those naps are extremely critical for healthy brain development.
So without good sleep hygiene, it can stunt brain development in a way that results in ADHD, or ADHD like symptoms.
Lots of people with ADHD have poor sleep hygiene, even as adults. Many will struggle with things like Delayed Sleep Phase Syndrome, because they get their biggest bursts of focus late at night when everyone else is asleep, the brain is releasing dopamine to keep them awake, and distractions are limited.
I have ADHD and DSPS. The reason people with DSPS feel awake at night is due to an issue with melatonin production. The brain doesn't release melatonin normally (or at all) so the natural "feeling sleepy" signal never comes. I take prescription tryptophan and I've never slept better in my life. My "natural" sleep time in 2/3am and waking up is 10/11am. But with tryptophan I can have a "normal" sleep schedule.
And that's another interesting thing. Kids diagnosed with ADHD can see improved outcomes when they are given tryptophan to help regulate sleep.
Btw, if you're wondering. Tryptophan is an amino acid, and you can get it in pills that have medically measured doses. Why not just take melatonin? Well tryptophan metabolizes into melatonin and serotonin. It's a guaranteed way to get melatonin.
Off the shelf melatonin pills aren't regulated with dosages the same way. In fact, a pill in a 10mg melatonin bottle might only have 1mg of melatonin or even 15mg. They aren't reliable, and the other issue is that melatonin tends to not be bioavailable enough to work reliably. Tryptophan is very bioavailable. It's the stuff in turkey that makes people sleepy after eating it.
Edit: grammar
