Gaming has a polarization problem
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With recent big game releases, it's become obvious that a game is either a resounding success, or complete shit. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground.
Kingdom Come Deliverance II is a ambitious masterpiece, and Avowed is lazy slop.
93% of Steam users recommend KCD2, vs 77% for Avowed.And maybe this has been an issue for a long time, fed by the need to get viewer numbers on articles and videos, leading to more polarized opinions that give people a reason to pick a side, even if they're never going to play the game.
But as regular people, gamers, Lemmy posters, why are we doing the same? How is it serving us? Are we all influencers in waiting, hoping to up our updoot count and build a following of... dozens?
More than 2/3rds of players of Dragon Age Veilguard recommend the game on Steam. And yet reading the comments here and other places, you'd think that 90% of people who tried the game found it to be, not just bad, but absolute trash, with a small number of people chiming in that they actually enjoyed it.
And game studios are reacting much the same way, and are quick to start layoffs, or shut down all together.
But hey, we don't owe those corporations anything.
But, as a community, do we owe it to each other to foster more honest correspondence? -
System shared this topic on
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With recent big game releases, it's become obvious that a game is either a resounding success, or complete shit. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground.
Kingdom Come Deliverance II is a ambitious masterpiece, and Avowed is lazy slop.
93% of Steam users recommend KCD2, vs 77% for Avowed.And maybe this has been an issue for a long time, fed by the need to get viewer numbers on articles and videos, leading to more polarized opinions that give people a reason to pick a side, even if they're never going to play the game.
But as regular people, gamers, Lemmy posters, why are we doing the same? How is it serving us? Are we all influencers in waiting, hoping to up our updoot count and build a following of... dozens?
More than 2/3rds of players of Dragon Age Veilguard recommend the game on Steam. And yet reading the comments here and other places, you'd think that 90% of people who tried the game found it to be, not just bad, but absolute trash, with a small number of people chiming in that they actually enjoyed it.
And game studios are reacting much the same way, and are quick to start layoffs, or shut down all together.
But hey, we don't owe those corporations anything.
But, as a community, do we owe it to each other to foster more honest correspondence?People are more likely to go online and complain than to compliment. But why take internet comments so seriously. I have a handful of trusted sources that I use to get my opinions on games. DLC Podcast for example is a favorite of mine. I've gotten to know their tastes and where they overlap with mine so when they get excited about a specific thing I'll know if I'm likely to enjoy it based on our shared interests.
When you get a handful of voices that have a strong overlap with your own taste then you can get outside of the tribalistic bitching of the hive. Comments don't even concern me anymore.
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With recent big game releases, it's become obvious that a game is either a resounding success, or complete shit. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground.
Kingdom Come Deliverance II is a ambitious masterpiece, and Avowed is lazy slop.
93% of Steam users recommend KCD2, vs 77% for Avowed.And maybe this has been an issue for a long time, fed by the need to get viewer numbers on articles and videos, leading to more polarized opinions that give people a reason to pick a side, even if they're never going to play the game.
But as regular people, gamers, Lemmy posters, why are we doing the same? How is it serving us? Are we all influencers in waiting, hoping to up our updoot count and build a following of... dozens?
More than 2/3rds of players of Dragon Age Veilguard recommend the game on Steam. And yet reading the comments here and other places, you'd think that 90% of people who tried the game found it to be, not just bad, but absolute trash, with a small number of people chiming in that they actually enjoyed it.
And game studios are reacting much the same way, and are quick to start layoffs, or shut down all together.
But hey, we don't owe those corporations anything.
But, as a community, do we owe it to each other to foster more honest correspondence?It’s been a problem for awhile. The media needs clicks so saying something is 7.5/10 doesn’t really drive engagement. Gamers have especially fed into this narrative because the media surrounding new products is always filled with hype and billed as the next greatest thing. It’s caused justified pushback from the community, but I think the pendulum has swung a bit in the other direction now. It’s tough feeling lukewarm about something when you’ve been told it’s supposed to be great. Additionally, the publishers, and some developers, in this industry are greedy cutthroats, which has made them easy targets for people’s frustration. The problem is now that frustration is focused on EVERYTHING involving the games industry.
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With recent big game releases, it's become obvious that a game is either a resounding success, or complete shit. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground.
Kingdom Come Deliverance II is a ambitious masterpiece, and Avowed is lazy slop.
93% of Steam users recommend KCD2, vs 77% for Avowed.And maybe this has been an issue for a long time, fed by the need to get viewer numbers on articles and videos, leading to more polarized opinions that give people a reason to pick a side, even if they're never going to play the game.
But as regular people, gamers, Lemmy posters, why are we doing the same? How is it serving us? Are we all influencers in waiting, hoping to up our updoot count and build a following of... dozens?
More than 2/3rds of players of Dragon Age Veilguard recommend the game on Steam. And yet reading the comments here and other places, you'd think that 90% of people who tried the game found it to be, not just bad, but absolute trash, with a small number of people chiming in that they actually enjoyed it.
And game studios are reacting much the same way, and are quick to start layoffs, or shut down all together.
But hey, we don't owe those corporations anything.
But, as a community, do we owe it to each other to foster more honest correspondence?People are complaining about Avowed? What the fuck is wrong with them?
I've been too busy loving it to be online reading anything, honestly cannot fathom what their complaints are tho. Avowed has repeatedly impressed me by being more clever and nuanced than I was expecting a game to be.
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People are more likely to go online and complain than to compliment. But why take internet comments so seriously. I have a handful of trusted sources that I use to get my opinions on games. DLC Podcast for example is a favorite of mine. I've gotten to know their tastes and where they overlap with mine so when they get excited about a specific thing I'll know if I'm likely to enjoy it based on our shared interests.
When you get a handful of voices that have a strong overlap with your own taste then you can get outside of the tribalistic bitching of the hive. Comments don't even concern me anymore.
Good ole Jeff Cannata!
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With recent big game releases, it's become obvious that a game is either a resounding success, or complete shit. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground.
Kingdom Come Deliverance II is a ambitious masterpiece, and Avowed is lazy slop.
93% of Steam users recommend KCD2, vs 77% for Avowed.And maybe this has been an issue for a long time, fed by the need to get viewer numbers on articles and videos, leading to more polarized opinions that give people a reason to pick a side, even if they're never going to play the game.
But as regular people, gamers, Lemmy posters, why are we doing the same? How is it serving us? Are we all influencers in waiting, hoping to up our updoot count and build a following of... dozens?
More than 2/3rds of players of Dragon Age Veilguard recommend the game on Steam. And yet reading the comments here and other places, you'd think that 90% of people who tried the game found it to be, not just bad, but absolute trash, with a small number of people chiming in that they actually enjoyed it.
And game studios are reacting much the same way, and are quick to start layoffs, or shut down all together.
But hey, we don't owe those corporations anything.
But, as a community, do we owe it to each other to foster more honest correspondence?From a mechanistic standpoint I think that mostly has to do with the high cost of entry for games.
At $80-$100 for a full priced game these days, it's hard to just buy on a whim. The only time you would is when they're on sale, which happens well after initial release. So initial sales of games are basically entirely driven by reviews and online discourse (which itself has an effect on reviews), and you basically just have a bunch of people all waiting for the signal to buy or not.
I do think that services like Gamepass are a genuinely good way of reducing that effect, because now anyone can try anything on a lark.
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Good ole Jeff Cannata!
Yup! Also the other host Christian appeals to the Sega kid in me. He'll uncover gems that evoke the Dreamcast era.
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With recent big game releases, it's become obvious that a game is either a resounding success, or complete shit. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground.
Kingdom Come Deliverance II is a ambitious masterpiece, and Avowed is lazy slop.
93% of Steam users recommend KCD2, vs 77% for Avowed.And maybe this has been an issue for a long time, fed by the need to get viewer numbers on articles and videos, leading to more polarized opinions that give people a reason to pick a side, even if they're never going to play the game.
But as regular people, gamers, Lemmy posters, why are we doing the same? How is it serving us? Are we all influencers in waiting, hoping to up our updoot count and build a following of... dozens?
More than 2/3rds of players of Dragon Age Veilguard recommend the game on Steam. And yet reading the comments here and other places, you'd think that 90% of people who tried the game found it to be, not just bad, but absolute trash, with a small number of people chiming in that they actually enjoyed it.
And game studios are reacting much the same way, and are quick to start layoffs, or shut down all together.
But hey, we don't owe those corporations anything.
But, as a community, do we owe it to each other to foster more honest correspondence?93% vs 77% doesn’t strike me as polarized. 16% difference?
77% doesn’t even seem that bad if it’s a style of game I like. From about 2001 I used to see sci fi movies that looked interesting as long as they had at least a 25% Rotten Tomatoes score because my tastes were different.
Is there something I’m missing? I haven’t played either game and I haven’t looked at reviews. Won’t buy KCD (no character creation) and probably will eventually buy Avowed.
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With recent big game releases, it's become obvious that a game is either a resounding success, or complete shit. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground.
Kingdom Come Deliverance II is a ambitious masterpiece, and Avowed is lazy slop.
93% of Steam users recommend KCD2, vs 77% for Avowed.And maybe this has been an issue for a long time, fed by the need to get viewer numbers on articles and videos, leading to more polarized opinions that give people a reason to pick a side, even if they're never going to play the game.
But as regular people, gamers, Lemmy posters, why are we doing the same? How is it serving us? Are we all influencers in waiting, hoping to up our updoot count and build a following of... dozens?
More than 2/3rds of players of Dragon Age Veilguard recommend the game on Steam. And yet reading the comments here and other places, you'd think that 90% of people who tried the game found it to be, not just bad, but absolute trash, with a small number of people chiming in that they actually enjoyed it.
And game studios are reacting much the same way, and are quick to start layoffs, or shut down all together.
But hey, we don't owe those corporations anything.
But, as a community, do we owe it to each other to foster more honest correspondence?Makes me appreciate reviews that are able to give pros and cons to the game, and the ones that are able to say an opinion between "best game ever" and "absolute trash". Which I still often see on the Steam reviews, usually voted as one of the Most Helpful!
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People are complaining about Avowed? What the fuck is wrong with them?
I've been too busy loving it to be online reading anything, honestly cannot fathom what their complaints are tho. Avowed has repeatedly impressed me by being more clever and nuanced than I was expecting a game to be.
Only heard a couple people talk about it online (that I trust to be reasonable) and they basically said it was fine but didn't blow them away. And that's fine but it makes for boring "cOnTeNt".
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People are complaining about Avowed? What the fuck is wrong with them?
I've been too busy loving it to be online reading anything, honestly cannot fathom what their complaints are tho. Avowed has repeatedly impressed me by being more clever and nuanced than I was expecting a game to be.
From what I've heard, its mostly people expecting the game to be more dynamic - more akin to Skyrim's varied gameplay systems or Fallout: NV's story and quests. They're going in expecting something with heavy RPG focus and getting something more action focused.
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With recent big game releases, it's become obvious that a game is either a resounding success, or complete shit. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground.
Kingdom Come Deliverance II is a ambitious masterpiece, and Avowed is lazy slop.
93% of Steam users recommend KCD2, vs 77% for Avowed.And maybe this has been an issue for a long time, fed by the need to get viewer numbers on articles and videos, leading to more polarized opinions that give people a reason to pick a side, even if they're never going to play the game.
But as regular people, gamers, Lemmy posters, why are we doing the same? How is it serving us? Are we all influencers in waiting, hoping to up our updoot count and build a following of... dozens?
More than 2/3rds of players of Dragon Age Veilguard recommend the game on Steam. And yet reading the comments here and other places, you'd think that 90% of people who tried the game found it to be, not just bad, but absolute trash, with a small number of people chiming in that they actually enjoyed it.
And game studios are reacting much the same way, and are quick to start layoffs, or shut down all together.
But hey, we don't owe those corporations anything.
But, as a community, do we owe it to each other to foster more honest correspondence?The only problem is that people are idiots, especially online. Go to any comment section and you'll find people angry at the content, no matter what the content is. And you're taking them seriously, for some reason. Laugh at them and move on, no more polarization problem. As you've said, 77% of people enjoyed avowed. Probably even more, as people are a lot more likely to leave a bad review than a good one.
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With recent big game releases, it's become obvious that a game is either a resounding success, or complete shit. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground.
Kingdom Come Deliverance II is a ambitious masterpiece, and Avowed is lazy slop.
93% of Steam users recommend KCD2, vs 77% for Avowed.And maybe this has been an issue for a long time, fed by the need to get viewer numbers on articles and videos, leading to more polarized opinions that give people a reason to pick a side, even if they're never going to play the game.
But as regular people, gamers, Lemmy posters, why are we doing the same? How is it serving us? Are we all influencers in waiting, hoping to up our updoot count and build a following of... dozens?
More than 2/3rds of players of Dragon Age Veilguard recommend the game on Steam. And yet reading the comments here and other places, you'd think that 90% of people who tried the game found it to be, not just bad, but absolute trash, with a small number of people chiming in that they actually enjoyed it.
And game studios are reacting much the same way, and are quick to start layoffs, or shut down all together.
But hey, we don't owe those corporations anything.
But, as a community, do we owe it to each other to foster more honest correspondence?Brother, picking on your example, Avowed had the gall to charge 11€ more than KCD2 while offering a facsimile of what it promised while KCD2 improved upon their past game in every way. The polarisation stems from a game published by one of the richest companies in the world and in production for over 6y delivering a mediocre experience (at best) when compared to CHEAPER offerings that do much more. In truth, it's not polarisation, it's requiring a modicum of quality for your money. I returned it because I was advertised an Obsidian RPG and got a linear shooter with barely any choices and performance issues that would not be foreign in a mobile marketplace. That's the future gamepass brings, slop. Luckily, there's US indie, Asian and European developers making good games, KCD2 or BG3 being such examples. Shit, even Lords of the Fallen is a better experience than Avowed as people were delivered the experience that was promised in the promotional materials at less than 70€.
Edit:
Dragon Age was technically well executed, but, again, as an RPG, it had little to offer. Would be another game perfect for a mobile app store. The total sales of that game and predicted sales of avowed confirm as much, it's shovelware capitalising on a franchise name to drive sales while having no craft or passion behind it. If you read the reviews for avowed, the overwhelming majority of the thumbs up reviews complain the game is not worth the price of admission and it's a mid game at best. -
With recent big game releases, it's become obvious that a game is either a resounding success, or complete shit. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground.
Kingdom Come Deliverance II is a ambitious masterpiece, and Avowed is lazy slop.
93% of Steam users recommend KCD2, vs 77% for Avowed.And maybe this has been an issue for a long time, fed by the need to get viewer numbers on articles and videos, leading to more polarized opinions that give people a reason to pick a side, even if they're never going to play the game.
But as regular people, gamers, Lemmy posters, why are we doing the same? How is it serving us? Are we all influencers in waiting, hoping to up our updoot count and build a following of... dozens?
More than 2/3rds of players of Dragon Age Veilguard recommend the game on Steam. And yet reading the comments here and other places, you'd think that 90% of people who tried the game found it to be, not just bad, but absolute trash, with a small number of people chiming in that they actually enjoyed it.
And game studios are reacting much the same way, and are quick to start layoffs, or shut down all together.
But hey, we don't owe those corporations anything.
But, as a community, do we owe it to each other to foster more honest correspondence?I don't think k this is a gaming problem.
It is a discourse problem.
People engage in absolutes. They either love a thing or hate a thing. There's no nuance.
And it must be made to cater for them, there's no expectation that it will contain choices they don't approve of.
And this stance, this modern relationship with the world permeates everything, especially forms of media.
You see it in films and books... Fans and stans and folk trying to take it down. There is no nuance or middle ground.
People don't accept that, perhaps, something isn't just "not for them". That's why you get grown men complaining about the direction of children's shows they used to watch.
And this is compounded with social media where polarisation, blunt takes and contradiction are the primary drivers of engagement.
Audience error.
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With recent big game releases, it's become obvious that a game is either a resounding success, or complete shit. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground.
Kingdom Come Deliverance II is a ambitious masterpiece, and Avowed is lazy slop.
93% of Steam users recommend KCD2, vs 77% for Avowed.And maybe this has been an issue for a long time, fed by the need to get viewer numbers on articles and videos, leading to more polarized opinions that give people a reason to pick a side, even if they're never going to play the game.
But as regular people, gamers, Lemmy posters, why are we doing the same? How is it serving us? Are we all influencers in waiting, hoping to up our updoot count and build a following of... dozens?
More than 2/3rds of players of Dragon Age Veilguard recommend the game on Steam. And yet reading the comments here and other places, you'd think that 90% of people who tried the game found it to be, not just bad, but absolute trash, with a small number of people chiming in that they actually enjoyed it.
And game studios are reacting much the same way, and are quick to start layoffs, or shut down all together.
But hey, we don't owe those corporations anything.
But, as a community, do we owe it to each other to foster more honest correspondence?i don't think they are polarising. imo, 77% is mid. nothing bad with a "just okay" game. sometimes you just want to play the experience of a new familiar world and this is it.
with tiktokers though, a mid game has less to talk about and so their narratives make what little or so difference sound like a big deal. sensationalism is where the money is for them.
i guess a good list of fair and reliable sources would help out here.
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With recent big game releases, it's become obvious that a game is either a resounding success, or complete shit. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground.
Kingdom Come Deliverance II is a ambitious masterpiece, and Avowed is lazy slop.
93% of Steam users recommend KCD2, vs 77% for Avowed.And maybe this has been an issue for a long time, fed by the need to get viewer numbers on articles and videos, leading to more polarized opinions that give people a reason to pick a side, even if they're never going to play the game.
But as regular people, gamers, Lemmy posters, why are we doing the same? How is it serving us? Are we all influencers in waiting, hoping to up our updoot count and build a following of... dozens?
More than 2/3rds of players of Dragon Age Veilguard recommend the game on Steam. And yet reading the comments here and other places, you'd think that 90% of people who tried the game found it to be, not just bad, but absolute trash, with a small number of people chiming in that they actually enjoyed it.
And game studios are reacting much the same way, and are quick to start layoffs, or shut down all together.
But hey, we don't owe those corporations anything.
But, as a community, do we owe it to each other to foster more honest correspondence?I’ve learned a long time ago that if you just wait a few years these games will go on sale for $20 and will have enough informed reviews to help make a solid purchasing decision. Gamers need to get off this new release hype train and be patient. I personally won’t play KCD 2, I disliked the first one. I will probably try Avowed in a few years after I get through my existing backlog of ~100 unplayed games in Steam. We are spoiled for choice and the market is filled with good indie games.
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Brother, picking on your example, Avowed had the gall to charge 11€ more than KCD2 while offering a facsimile of what it promised while KCD2 improved upon their past game in every way. The polarisation stems from a game published by one of the richest companies in the world and in production for over 6y delivering a mediocre experience (at best) when compared to CHEAPER offerings that do much more. In truth, it's not polarisation, it's requiring a modicum of quality for your money. I returned it because I was advertised an Obsidian RPG and got a linear shooter with barely any choices and performance issues that would not be foreign in a mobile marketplace. That's the future gamepass brings, slop. Luckily, there's US indie, Asian and European developers making good games, KCD2 or BG3 being such examples. Shit, even Lords of the Fallen is a better experience than Avowed as people were delivered the experience that was promised in the promotional materials at less than 70€.
Edit:
Dragon Age was technically well executed, but, again, as an RPG, it had little to offer. Would be another game perfect for a mobile app store. The total sales of that game and predicted sales of avowed confirm as much, it's shovelware capitalising on a franchise name to drive sales while having no craft or passion behind it. If you read the reviews for avowed, the overwhelming majority of the thumbs up reviews complain the game is not worth the price of admission and it's a mid game at best.I am sorry, but it seems your Avowed is different from the one I am playing. I agree with your comment, but I am enjoying Avowed like I haven't enjoyed any game in years! And barely any choices? Really? I just finished the first area (not the tutorial), and there were LOTS of meaningful choices! But speaking of the tutorial, there was a choice there that impacted certain future interactions. The R is definitely there in this RPG. I haven't played a game where even the little choices matter as much as in this game!
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I don't think k this is a gaming problem.
It is a discourse problem.
People engage in absolutes. They either love a thing or hate a thing. There's no nuance.
And it must be made to cater for them, there's no expectation that it will contain choices they don't approve of.
And this stance, this modern relationship with the world permeates everything, especially forms of media.
You see it in films and books... Fans and stans and folk trying to take it down. There is no nuance or middle ground.
People don't accept that, perhaps, something isn't just "not for them". That's why you get grown men complaining about the direction of children's shows they used to watch.
And this is compounded with social media where polarisation, blunt takes and contradiction are the primary drivers of engagement.
Audience error.
It's absolutely not just a gaming problem. Movie reviews are getting more and more bandwagon-y. Only a few reviewers post in the first day or two, and everyone else says "okay, they hated it, now I have to hate it too or I'm going to lose credibility". I think it's the inevitable outcome of having less famous reviewers, a NYT columnist can post what they feel, but a small blog can fall into obscurity if they have one contrarian review.
The only part that's unique to gaming is that gamers are the most toxic community in the internet.
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It's absolutely not just a gaming problem. Movie reviews are getting more and more bandwagon-y. Only a few reviewers post in the first day or two, and everyone else says "okay, they hated it, now I have to hate it too or I'm going to lose credibility". I think it's the inevitable outcome of having less famous reviewers, a NYT columnist can post what they feel, but a small blog can fall into obscurity if they have one contrarian review.
The only part that's unique to gaming is that gamers are the most toxic community in the internet.
The only part that's unique to gaming is that gamers are the most toxic community in the internet.
I wish this wasn't as true as it is.
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With recent big game releases, it's become obvious that a game is either a resounding success, or complete shit. There doesn't seem to be any middle ground.
Kingdom Come Deliverance II is a ambitious masterpiece, and Avowed is lazy slop.
93% of Steam users recommend KCD2, vs 77% for Avowed.And maybe this has been an issue for a long time, fed by the need to get viewer numbers on articles and videos, leading to more polarized opinions that give people a reason to pick a side, even if they're never going to play the game.
But as regular people, gamers, Lemmy posters, why are we doing the same? How is it serving us? Are we all influencers in waiting, hoping to up our updoot count and build a following of... dozens?
More than 2/3rds of players of Dragon Age Veilguard recommend the game on Steam. And yet reading the comments here and other places, you'd think that 90% of people who tried the game found it to be, not just bad, but absolute trash, with a small number of people chiming in that they actually enjoyed it.
And game studios are reacting much the same way, and are quick to start layoffs, or shut down all together.
But hey, we don't owe those corporations anything.
But, as a community, do we owe it to each other to foster more honest correspondence?With the amount of 9s and 10s coming out, why would you waste time with a 7? The polarisation is just an effect of the language of clickbait spreading in society, but doesn't change the fact that average games are probably not worth your time.
