Why Gen Z Is Ditching Dating Apps
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I don't think the status quo is good evidence. We do studies because we know how messy life is. You could just as easily be proving my point as you think you're proving yours.
Why do strip clubs exist? Idk, but it could be because men are more comfortable being sexual. As there is less shame in going to a strip club than working for one.
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Not just zoomers.
I'm a grumpy old-inneial, and I dumped them a while ago.
The big reason is they've become fucking awful exploitative shitshows. Paywalls for everything, nonstop popups to buy shit, push notifications about things that you should pay for, fake messages that there's "waiting matches" if I just pay $39.95, and the dark pattern bullshit you expect off scam websites: limited time sales, limited volume sales, 'act now or it's gone forever' nonsense.
And, if that wasn't bad enough, what you would get, if you paid for it, is flakes, fakes, scammers, and catfishers. Like, while hovering in the free pity-zone you get get, I got a ton of matches. I'd say out of ~60 matches, 25 were outright scams (Oh hello, I am kindly wanting to get laid, please contact me on the app I use every day, telegram!), 20 were fakes (quick reverse image search showed that shockingly, that image was, in fact, not someone who felt the need to actually use dating apps), 10 were people who had decade old pictures or very, very selective angles, and the last 5 were conversations that totally went to plans and then... nothing.
Now, I'm gay, so I already have a HUGE advantage over the poor straghts, because everyone is there to get laid, and thus the bullshit is usually a lot less minimal. Don't have to convince a dude all that hard, or play the make-sure-you-answer-the-question-correctly shit my straight friends have to deal with.
But, even then, over the course of a month, it was just a case of being nagged to death to spend money, and every interaction being total bullshit, which doesn't really make you want to spend the time OR money.
And before you assume it's just me, I went on dates and uh, more, 3 times in the same month off people I met from Snapchat. From the random-people-you-should-add list. So, I'll assume it's not just me, and that those apps have rotted to the point they're literally worse than random people on Snapchat, which is a hell of an achievement.
And I'll 2nd the just meeting people at things in real life. People can't play the stupid shit games if they're standing in front of you: it's hard to be a scam or a fake, and your ability to catfish is limited to trying to suck your gut in, which isn't really something someone is likely to miss you doing.
I do think, though, that there were useful dating apps before they got ingested into the match.com umbrella, but they have been, so it's just a wilderness of enshittified piles of poo as far as you can see.
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"There are piles of poo just waiting to match with YOU! Only $14.99/week!"
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18/f/cali
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Don't say "dating apps" like there's not a monopoly - this is all Match
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You could just as easily be proving my point as you think you're proving yours.
How on Earth would the overwhelming majority of strip clubs featuring naked women be evidence that women are as horny as guys?
But fine, remove the physical shame etc. Set your browser to incognito, google porn and let me know how long it takes before you find a site catering to women instead of guys.
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yes, they do this kind of propaganda to young people since gen x. its all bullshit.
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Ya missed my point a bit. Maybe I wasn't so clear. I'm not saying strip clubs prove women are more horny. I'm saying it is reaonsable to assume asymertic distribution of gender roles in strip clubs is influenced by our current culture more than biology. Given no actual evidence it is reasonable to see it either way.
Saying "Just look!" is as good as "Common sense". Its extremely culturally embeded and not necessarily reflective of any underlying truth.
I'm saying you didn't prove anything to me. I'm not saying whether anything is true or untrue at a global level.
Woman may be more or less horny than men. In my sample they are more horny. Maybe I'm just getting older.
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As the conversation is about people who exist in the world as it is, not theoretical women in an abstract land, it seems perfectly reasonable to include the current distribution as skewed by current culture.
Did you mean to respond to a different thread where people were talking about biologically and removed culture conditions?
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I get a little lost in the sauce when I get typing. I stand by most of what I said, but maybe some isn't pertinent.
Let me try and be super clear. In my sample women are more horny than men. In yours it is the other way.
Giving examples of men being outwardly sexual doesn't prove that they feel it more. Just because more businesses cater to men doesn't mean they feel it more. You are giving very surface level and indirect proof and calling it evidence.
I'm not working in abstract land, just not your land I guess.
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Unsure where you're getting my sample from.
I'm using actual things that exist rather than my own experience because I understand that my experiences are not universal and are inherently subjective. Making blanket statements based on anyone's experience is nonsensical.
And businesses, like online porn catering to men are pretty decent proof that men are hornier, that's how capitalism works. Where a desire exists, businesses will fill it. Unless women are drastically poorer (a little so but hardly enough to rationalize an entire industry all but not existing) then a lack of demand indicates... you guessed it, a lack of demand.
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What if women's sexuality is felt differently, and porn isn't a perfect fit?
Here is how you sound: Do you know much about smut novels? Women must be much more horny given that they buy way more of those than guys do. No reason guys would buy less other than being less horny.
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Also how do I add alt text to image on here...
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Yes, romance novels are popular, relative to the dying publishing industry. In terms of money per industry, there's no comparing online porn to smut novels though.
Basically, all you've been able to claim is that you have known some ladies you feel are as horny as you think average guys are and no amount of "okay, let's see if this holds up in the world beyond your perception of a handful of people" will change your mind. It's kind of wild in a silly little way.
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What would prove it to me? Good question it'd have to be grounded. I don't like to claim I know things I can't know. Who's hornier is just such a tough question. Everyone experiences hornyness in different ways and we can't really order them or make equivalences easily.
Basically there'd have to be a good definition of "this action equals this much hornyness" and I haven't seem anything presented that can measure that in a satisfactory way.
I mean I could draw a hot picture for myself for free and that wouldn't be counted in the frame "horniness is measured in money". I really am not convinced by the money stats. Sex is often free.
I really don't think we have the tools to answer this question. At least I haven't seen them.
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But how do you keep making the line go up, especially in a "market" with such a guaranteed drop-off point in user retention? You can do what these companies do and fill your apps with bots to keep engagement metrics up and users coming back as they fail to date your fake users. I'd call that enshittification, and it probably makes everything worse in this case.
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It is enshittification and it’s how they make money. But my point is that fixing enshittification doesn’t fix daring apps in the long term.
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This brings up an interesting point because my first thought when I read "inundated with sexualized media their whole lives," my first thought was, "In this Puritan culture?!" On the one hand, ads are all about using sex to sell products, while on the other, advertisers want nothing to do with anything that isn't 'kid friendly' content. You just need to look at how sanitized the internet has become by corporations to see that at work.
But I think there's something to be said there, and I think it goes deeper than just "the kids these days live in a Godless society of homosexual perverts" or whatever. I think the normalization of sex and availability of information about sex and sexuality has probably influenced it. I'd also say that the current state of the world and the stress of daily life have as much of an influence on this as the amount of sexualized media in their everyday lives. It's been a noticeable thing with Milennials having less sex and fewer kids from stress, both financial and otherwise, and I see no reason that wouldn't continue to trickle down to other generations. And even the amount of media out there, regardless of type, has just as much of an effect. If you have books to read and movies to watch, you're less likely to pop out kids accidentally because you were bored and got frisky.
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Very true. I was just saying that you can also blame enshittification for it going down like it has as well. Burning the candle at both ends and all that.
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And loot boxes too.
