Plex now want to SELL your personal data
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Sunk cost. It took me loosing my Plex watch history to say fuck it I'm going to Jellyfin.
I saw several solutions on Github that could migrate it.
Assuming you use/-d trakt you could use that to re-import the watch history -
Companies want your money. The more they know about you, the more possibilities they have to get it. You don't know what the political landscape may look like down the road. You may feel safe now, but that can change quickly. Imagine you suddenly need to pay back money to the copyright owners unless you can prove you already did?
wrote last edited by [email protected]And just like that we’re at silly made up hypothetical situations to drive fear and an agenda. That’s not even worth entertaining.
Btw these changes and the data that is shared/sold are only for plex’s hosted movies and shows - not your personal media collection.
We do not and will not collect information about content or titles in your personal media library or what you’ve played.
Personal media users: we do NOT, and will not, share or sell any information about the content and titles on or your use of a personal media server.
Source: link in the OP
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You are saying many things about the legality of this, especially internationally and regarding what Plex is or isn't obligated to do, that are a bit of a stretch. But man, are they put in context by the admission of left wing cosplay there at the end where you concede you do think "a little bit of crime is good, actually", which explains a lot of the hack the world mentality and why you feel so cool and dangerous by sharing some torrents you got with a slightly larger group of people than your direct family.
I still do think that's counterproductive if you ever want a scenario where the late-capitalist media distribution landscape gets at least a modicum of competition from more reasonable and sustainable alternatives. That you prefer to feel edgy than to propose a viable scenario for that is all well and good, but I wish you didn't feel the need to do that at people.
For the record, you are still wrong about SSO. Again it makes sense that if you're cosplaying cops and robbers "this thing bad, this thing bad, both together worse" sounds reasonable, but if you really were at risk of any real legal liability that's really not how that would play out. In the real world ANY leak of that information from any source would be an absolute problem. So the Google login could be a problem by itself, and the Plex data gathering would be a much bigger problem by itself, but both together would just mean you are exactly as screwed as with just one.
But you think it's cool to crap on Google (which I guess it is) and are cosplaying, so that's a cool thing to perform outrage about even if it doesn't really matter in this scenario. Which I'm increasingly realizing is all this conversation is about, from the "I'm so good at networking and system administration" braggadocio to the "I'm such a dangerous anarchist criminal that doesn't give a crap about the rules because I'm so good they can't catch me" stuff.
FWIW, I do care about self-hosting as a viable commercial alternative and about a legal framework to support it, but even if I didn't think it was possible (which it is, and some people at least are working along those lines) I am not ready to give up on the changes required to get there just to feel cool on the Internet. You do you, though, just... try not to scare the normies away. Not that there are any normies around here anyway, so I guess we're safe on that front.
So the Google login could be a problem by itself, and the Plex data gathering would be a much bigger problem by itself, but both together would just mean you are exactly as screwed as with just one.
That's almost exactly what I was saying, except that using both actually increases your risk just by capturing more detailed logs of your server activity and the associated accounts. Your users could use anonymous usernames or share login credentials if they wanted to without it, but being forced to use google SSO means each user is personally identifiable even if they're protecting themselves otherwise. It's the same reason I would never use google's SSO for another web service if I had an alternative, even if for something completely innocuous. Why give them extra information about my web activity and tie it directly to my verified account, even if it's something trivial like what plex servers i use or how I'm watching my media and on what devices?
But mostly my point was that using google's SSO by itself, with your own self-hosted server is dumb because it unnecessarily exposes you where you otherwise would have been fine. That was the whole point of this conversation - not that plex was specifically bad because they used it, but that it isn't a desirable feature for plex or for a self-hosted alternative. Maybe you just misunderstood that, idk.
cosplay
Where I am people are being black bagged for less than just breaking DRM. I could be disappeared on my way to work tomorrow just for saying something silly like "from the river to the sea". Maybe you're privileged enough to feel secure in your legal standing, but that's not one that I share. Like I said, i've gotten burned for using napster when I was young and dumb, and I thought I was safe then, too.
For most people this side of the pacific, ripping DVD's for personal use is not legal, and streaming them to others is even less so. Any service hosted within the US is subject to that law. You being outside the US but using a private service hosted within it puts you squarely within that jurisdiction, but since you fancy yourself a lawyer, and since IDGAF anyway, i'll let you mull it over for yourself. If all you're afraid of losing is access to your plex account then all the power to ya. I just don't agree with that value judgement.
I'm honestly not sure why you feel so cavalier about your data privacy. If you're really one of those 'i've got nothing to hide' folks, I have a larger gripe with you than what a silly 'plex vs jellyfin' debate can cover. It's incredibly shortsighted and normalizes apathy and complacency. There's no reason to be exposing your private server usage data to private for-profit companies, especially when that activity is already borderline legal at best. My actual fear is that plex gains mainstream attention and comes under legal scrutiny. we go through another tightening of the screws because our bloated media market is bleeding and dragging the rest of the stock market down with it. That's what happened with napster and the record industry, and it'll happen with streamers and plex if we're not a little more discrete.
Yes, rip your dvds. Yes, share them with whoever you want. Go pirate some animes or download a car, IDGAF. But don't pretend like you're somehow safe from punitive copyright action just because you're off in Greenland or whereverthefuck. You'll end up teaching normies bad habits and poor judgement when it comes to protecting their data privacy.
Again, just don't be a dumbass about it.
I do care about self-hosting as a viable commercial alternative
Well there you go. I would really rather self-hosting not even be commercial.
I am not ready to give up on the changes required to get there just to feel cool on the Internet
Lmao yes look at me and my data hygiene, you'll never be as cool as me. It's clear that you have some misgivings about FOSS as a concept, I guess you can feel good about donating your money to a for-profit entity as a way to stick it to those hippies. God forbid I had tried selling you on linux in this thread, that could have really snowballed.
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It's opt-in. Zero issue here.
Because Plex would never dare to turn this on by default for everyone...?
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Text:
I consent to Plex to: (i) sell certain personal information (hashed emails, advertising identifiers) to third-parties for advertising and marketing purposes; and (ii) store and/or access certain personal information (advertising identifiers, IP address, content being watched) on my device(s) and share that information with Plex’s advertising partners. This data is used to deliver personalised ads and content, ad and content measurement, audience insights and product development. Your consent applies to all devices on which you have Plex installed. You can withdraw your consent at any time in
Account Settings or using this page.Soure: https://www.plex.tv/vendors/
(Might have to clear cache)Can also read about the changes here:
https://www.plex.tv/about/privacy-legal/wrote last edited by [email protected]I can imagine this data would sell for quite a bit of money. Networks love to winge about how much they lose to piracy
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No, I don’t generally carry Firesticks around with me.
So assuming you are traveling, what do you bring with you if it isn't a mobile streaming device, a laptop, or a mobile device that you are going to stream to?
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I'll look into Tailscale then. I'm guessing there's something funky about adding additional users. I would eventually like to add one or two other people.
It's not that hard but they will have to make accounts and set the correct exit node or use the weird magic dns. Takes some hand-holding and depends on how you set things up.
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Did you notice that they're using a local connection? Still requires VPN/reverse proxy to get it outside the home.
They didn't mention it in the post I reacted to.
But both of your suggestions are excellent solutions to the problem. -
And just like that we’re at silly made up hypothetical situations to drive fear and an agenda. That’s not even worth entertaining.
Btw these changes and the data that is shared/sold are only for plex’s hosted movies and shows - not your personal media collection.
We do not and will not collect information about content or titles in your personal media library or what you’ve played.
Personal media users: we do NOT, and will not, share or sell any information about the content and titles on or your use of a personal media server.
Source: link in the OP
Lmao we already see people are being influenced by social media and targeted marketing, where do you think the source of that is? Do you think you're immune? Think again. And it's not just about selling you things, it's about shaping how and what you think. And what's the agenda I'm trying to drive in your eyes?
You're right that they for now don't sell personal library streaming information, let's see how long it stays that way.
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Text:
I consent to Plex to: (i) sell certain personal information (hashed emails, advertising identifiers) to third-parties for advertising and marketing purposes; and (ii) store and/or access certain personal information (advertising identifiers, IP address, content being watched) on my device(s) and share that information with Plex’s advertising partners. This data is used to deliver personalised ads and content, ad and content measurement, audience insights and product development. Your consent applies to all devices on which you have Plex installed. You can withdraw your consent at any time in
Account Settings or using this page.Soure: https://www.plex.tv/vendors/
(Might have to clear cache)Can also read about the changes here:
https://www.plex.tv/about/privacy-legal/Stopped using plex, replaced with jellyfin
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Are you okay?
I didn't compare mine to yours at all. You're the one that said your 28 USD service was a better deal. YOU made the comparison. YOU asked for the details.
No, he provided details for his internet first. You're the one who came in comparing your business contract internet with his non-business one. Did you just conveniently forget that?
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Because Plex would never dare to turn this on by default for everyone...?
It’s also not for your personal media, only what you watch of their hosted content. They aren’t selling that your most watched thing is your highly curated big booty whores collection.
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For those who aren't quite ready to delete their accounts get, this link buried on their privacy page can let you opt out: https://www.plex.tv/vendors-us
Not sure why "us" is in the URL, I'm in Canada
Didn’t even need to dig. As soon as I opened Plex in my browser, it gave me a giant full screen “hey we want to sell your data. Do you consent” page. I disagree with data sale in general, but at least they didn’t go out of their way to bury the opt out. In fact, they actually went out of their way to present the notification in a way that was impossible to miss. If you’re capable of reading, you’ll know what the popup is for.
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Need a jellyfin PS5 app
And a Samsung TV app. There’s an entire branch of Samsung TVs that require side loading to get a Jellyfin app installed.
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So the Google login could be a problem by itself, and the Plex data gathering would be a much bigger problem by itself, but both together would just mean you are exactly as screwed as with just one.
That's almost exactly what I was saying, except that using both actually increases your risk just by capturing more detailed logs of your server activity and the associated accounts. Your users could use anonymous usernames or share login credentials if they wanted to without it, but being forced to use google SSO means each user is personally identifiable even if they're protecting themselves otherwise. It's the same reason I would never use google's SSO for another web service if I had an alternative, even if for something completely innocuous. Why give them extra information about my web activity and tie it directly to my verified account, even if it's something trivial like what plex servers i use or how I'm watching my media and on what devices?
But mostly my point was that using google's SSO by itself, with your own self-hosted server is dumb because it unnecessarily exposes you where you otherwise would have been fine. That was the whole point of this conversation - not that plex was specifically bad because they used it, but that it isn't a desirable feature for plex or for a self-hosted alternative. Maybe you just misunderstood that, idk.
cosplay
Where I am people are being black bagged for less than just breaking DRM. I could be disappeared on my way to work tomorrow just for saying something silly like "from the river to the sea". Maybe you're privileged enough to feel secure in your legal standing, but that's not one that I share. Like I said, i've gotten burned for using napster when I was young and dumb, and I thought I was safe then, too.
For most people this side of the pacific, ripping DVD's for personal use is not legal, and streaming them to others is even less so. Any service hosted within the US is subject to that law. You being outside the US but using a private service hosted within it puts you squarely within that jurisdiction, but since you fancy yourself a lawyer, and since IDGAF anyway, i'll let you mull it over for yourself. If all you're afraid of losing is access to your plex account then all the power to ya. I just don't agree with that value judgement.
I'm honestly not sure why you feel so cavalier about your data privacy. If you're really one of those 'i've got nothing to hide' folks, I have a larger gripe with you than what a silly 'plex vs jellyfin' debate can cover. It's incredibly shortsighted and normalizes apathy and complacency. There's no reason to be exposing your private server usage data to private for-profit companies, especially when that activity is already borderline legal at best. My actual fear is that plex gains mainstream attention and comes under legal scrutiny. we go through another tightening of the screws because our bloated media market is bleeding and dragging the rest of the stock market down with it. That's what happened with napster and the record industry, and it'll happen with streamers and plex if we're not a little more discrete.
Yes, rip your dvds. Yes, share them with whoever you want. Go pirate some animes or download a car, IDGAF. But don't pretend like you're somehow safe from punitive copyright action just because you're off in Greenland or whereverthefuck. You'll end up teaching normies bad habits and poor judgement when it comes to protecting their data privacy.
Again, just don't be a dumbass about it.
I do care about self-hosting as a viable commercial alternative
Well there you go. I would really rather self-hosting not even be commercial.
I am not ready to give up on the changes required to get there just to feel cool on the Internet
Lmao yes look at me and my data hygiene, you'll never be as cool as me. It's clear that you have some misgivings about FOSS as a concept, I guess you can feel good about donating your money to a for-profit entity as a way to stick it to those hippies. God forbid I had tried selling you on linux in this thread, that could have really snowballed.
I mean, my Plex server is on a Fedora machine, it seems to be doing fine. I have gotten into arguments here about how frustrating it is that Linux advocates pretend every usability problem for Windows users is solved and that "just use Mint" is a valid solution to that issue. If you want to know how that goes, it goes a lot like this conversation.
On topic, using any external login or remote access third party service for your self hosted services is a significant change in how much info is not controlled by you, nobody is arguing that. There's a conversation to be had about whether that's worth it for most users. Like I said earlier, is it a good thing for Home Assistant to provide a paid subscription service that will handle that for you? For most people I'd say yes, it's still a much safer, more flexible alternative to Google's or Amazon's ecosystem, so why not? Baby steps.
But if you're already using a commercial service that already has a proprietary login then no, it doesn't matter. Plex already knows which clients go to your server. It does not need Google for anything here, having Google's SSO doesn't give them any information they already have. It does give that to Google, but if your concern is the cops are going to bang on your door for all your illegal pixels that you stream then you're just as boned. It's borderline irresponsible to pretend otherwise.
As for the "I have nothing to hide" thing... look, if you want to have this argument with someone else go pester them instead. It's not "I have nothing to hide", it's "this commercial service that I use does something that is legal and I intend to both take advantage of that and defend my right to own my media". How you get "I have nothing to hide" out of that is your own pretzel logic.
I have a right to store, backup and access my own media and to keep a copy of it for private use. I will exercise that right regardless of how many US corpos pretend that hey own the very concept of showing video to people. I am doing nothing illegal here and of the perfectly legal software options to do this perfectly legal thing I chose the one that had better usability for my family to be comfortable using it. This comes at the cost of an external service storing some of our data, just like our Netlfix and Disney+ subscriptions do, but since I'm not keeping a media server performatively that is a tradeoff we have made on a bunch of places because not everybody who lives here is willing to do homework to be able to use their devices. That cool with you?
For the record, I don't have any misgivings about FOSS as a concept. I do have remarkable contempt for people who want it to keep being a minority option because they like being in the secret treehouse and don't want everybody else learning about it. Widespread, successful FOSS doesn't look like half-baked UX and hobbyist programmers working for nothing in their spare time, and I would certainly like to see a landscape where alongisde hobby projects we have a solid stable of financially sustainable professionally made open source alternatives that anybody can get into. Jellyfin isn't even the worse offender here. If nothing else it's frustrating because it could be a more approachable sustainable alternative in the vein of your Blenders or Home Assistants... but it's kinda not, and that sucks.
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Text:
I consent to Plex to: (i) sell certain personal information (hashed emails, advertising identifiers) to third-parties for advertising and marketing purposes; and (ii) store and/or access certain personal information (advertising identifiers, IP address, content being watched) on my device(s) and share that information with Plex’s advertising partners. This data is used to deliver personalised ads and content, ad and content measurement, audience insights and product development. Your consent applies to all devices on which you have Plex installed. You can withdraw your consent at any time in
Account Settings or using this page.Soure: https://www.plex.tv/vendors/
(Might have to clear cache)Can also read about the changes here:
https://www.plex.tv/about/privacy-legal/It's interesting to see the different kind of comments here and on Redshit.
Here, people are smart and they are switching to Jellyfin. On Redshit, if people mention Jellyfin in a comment they get downvoted right away.
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There is a native Apple TV app, I didn't migrate from plex until there was and I migrated over 18 months ago. It's called Swiftfin.
Swiftfin is basically a pre-beta release: it's barely usable and doesnt' support HDR or DolbyVision.
The lack of an AppleTV app isthe only thing that is stopping me switchwing from Plex.
I tried infuse and worked perfectly, but sadly it doens't support multi-profiles (on Plex i have a separate profile with kid's movies) -
I doubt they're thinking at all if writing a web address is too much lol
"Facebook dot what? Stop the tech speak, nerd!"
Then, you are completely out of touch with how most people use computers.
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Can someone clue me in on the reason why anyone would prefer Plex instead of Jellyfin?
It just works and has a native app for basically everything.
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Then, you are completely out of touch with how most people use computers.
wrote last edited by [email protected]I'm not sure if you're just surrounded by mentally deficient people for some reason or seriously underestimating them, but pretty much everyone I know can type in a website address lol
Or maybe it's some zoomie "what's a computer" thing
