Tesla’s 2024 financial results are out—and they’re terrible

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So more than a third of their net profits come from selling credits they received from the government? Am I understanding that correctly?

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My point is, if this is how markets react to worsening sales and an actually insane CEO how can you trust a rational bet to pay off?

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That but also removing green subsidies helps Tesla as it's further ahead than other electric car rivals. Also, less safety regulations likely brings it closer to fully autonomous driving.

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I'm glad for them.

they don't make electric vehicles. they make human sized battery powered over engineered poorly designed toys that were somehow street legal.

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It's bad because the company is bad and they should collapse, not continue on.

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aims to grow automotive sales by more than 60% in 2025.

I think this is being reported incorrectly in a lot of places.

They said the new vehicles they're launching in 2025 will allow them to grow 60% to the 3 million capacity they have.

They did not say in 2025. But it looked like it meant 2025.

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Value investors don't invest in Tesla, so you should not expect its share price to reflect fundamentals.

But they do invest in stocks like Coca Cola and American Express, so you should expect the share prices of those companies to better reflect fundamentals.

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Source on the killing of credits?

Those are California ZEV credits, and other similar non USA programs.

They're going to kill a lot of other things, but haven't heard about that yet.

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When you know you're going to get a billion dollars in credits for something, you plan your business around having those billion credits.

You sell cars cheaper, you expand faster, you try new ideas you might not have tried.

Tesla hasn't needed those credits for a very long time now, but if they are there, of course they're going to take as full advantage of the situation as they can.

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This one is paywalled, but if you hit the firefox reader mode button quick enough you can bypass BI's content blocker.

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Just on mobile now so can't read it all, but I still think they'd have to win a lawsuit against California saying California can't have the program?

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You just glossed right over the "dropped by 71%" bit...since when is that not terrible? That's an incredible decrease in profits over the course of just 12 months.

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Not in this world.

People will be pushed to buy the products. Patriotism, xenophobia, lies, economic fear and tariffs, straight up government manipulation and collusion.

That’s the value Elon has, Zuck is jealous of, Tesla and the shareholders will benefit from, and the people allow.

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Expensive luxury cars for rich people with over 30 thousand subsidy, and they still lose money. But, hey, credits is the new Bitcoin.

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That's just another way of saying buyer sentiment is the only thing that matters, in which case we're back to square one.

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Tesla would never exist in a capitalist system. Their business model is wholly predicated on government subsidies and carbon credits. Furthermore, the hen has come home to roost and their cars, like I linked above, are just bougie expensive paper weights sold by the biggest con man in history. If I was buying electric tomorrow, I'd even look at Volkswagen before considering a Tesla. I want my cars to last more than 4y, not try to kill me, and, I don't like to pay extra for vapoware. If anything, the fact Tesla still exists, is testament we no longer live in a capitalist system but in an oligarchy where companies selling snake oil can still have high valuation because they are close to the ~~N*%i Party~~ party in power. Looking at Teslas's results and seeing the carbon credit weight on their fundamentals and looking at the speed BYD is expanding, only Authoritarianism can save them from bankruptcy already in 2025. Luckily, their CEO just helped bring about the 4th reich, so they are fine, just don't pretend it's because it's a solid enterprise, it's anything but.

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If you're a value investor then you believe that the actual value of a company depends on its current and future earnings.

And while the market price will tend towards the actual value in the long run, there are other factors that also influence the market price.

In fact, the whole point of value investing is that for various reasons some stocks are "underpriced", ie currently priced at a discount to their actual value. Those are the stocks you should buy, and you should expect their price to increase.

Conversely, for various reasons some stocks are "overpriced", like Tesla. You should not buy those, because you expect their price to decrease in the long run.

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Exclusive contracts at 20% mark up. Can’t wait for all police vehicles to switch over to teslas.

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I'm sure that Musk hopes that "people will be pushed to buy" his products.

But so far, that plan isn't working. In fact it's backfiring, people are running away from his products.

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Right. So anyway, the market does often appear oversensitive to buzz and under-responsive to fundamentals. What's your take on market reforms? Are there any changes you'd like to see, regulatory or otherwise?

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Tesla’s 2024 financial results are out—and they’re terrible