Norwegian tourist claims he was 'strip searched' before being denied entry to US over JD Vance meme on phone
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I don't understand this, why not call him the way he wants to be called ? He's despicable but his name isn't the problem, I don't see how calling him Bowman (or calling Donald "Drumpf") is making any progress.
And it kind of undermines the discourse that we should respect people's choice as to how they define themselves.
BTW, the Trump family changed their name before they even came to America, unfortunately - it was such a good story. I still like to call him that from time to time, but also Mango Mussolini, Orange Baby or just mad megalomaniac.
And without him and his ilk we wouldn't even have a "discourse that we should respect people’s choice as to how they define themselves" because that would just be the norm, no need to "discourse" about it.
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Add that's why certain employers already give a burner phone to their employees if they have to go to the USA.
But I heard they also demand access to ALL social media accounts, which aren't tied to a device.
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you do not have a legitimate reason to travel there now.
My parents live here
I live here
Damn. So sorry.
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Why isn't it that simple? People leave their countries for a better life everyday. If the situation is as bad as claimed I can see no reason why regardless of complexity it isn't the option chosen.
Lack of financials, knowledge, and support? "If the situation is as bad as claimed" is crazy tbh.
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But I heard they also demand access to ALL social media accounts, which aren't tied to a device.
They can demand it, but you can't prove a negative.
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"Quick! He might be hiding more memes in his ass!" Like what?
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They can demand it, but you can't prove a negative.
True. Yeah, I was wondering how that plays out if you simply reply "There are none."
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But I heard they also demand access to ALL social media accounts, which aren't tied to a device.
If you have 2 factor authentication, and the authentication device is on another continent, you don't have any means to access the accounts even if they demand it.
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Lack of financials, knowledge, and support? "If the situation is as bad as claimed" is crazy tbh.
That sounds a lot like the conditions for people who leave other countries for a better life.
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Yeah I actually am thirsty to know what specifically made you think I'm bigoted. We can agree to disagree about everything else but being called a bigot is pretty serious
A bigot is a person who strongly and unfairly dislikes others based on their beliefs, race, or religion, often refusing to accept different ideas or groups. This term is commonly used to describe someone who holds prejudiced views.
Now that you know what the word means, try some self reflection.
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Why isn't it that simple? People leave their countries for a better life everyday. If the situation is as bad as claimed I can see no reason why regardless of complexity it isn't the option chosen.
You see, her CDs are in his truck.
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What kind of dumb fuck still goes to the US for tourism?
For many a trip to the US from Europe is a major event. I'd imagine that many people planned their trips last year before Trump was even reelected and had already invested a lot of money, at which point sunk fallacy plays a role.
I also think that for many it still hasn't registered that they are now also at risk and it's not just the classic family guy meme anymore, where it's based on skin colour.
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That sounds a lot like the conditions for people who leave other countries for a better life.
wrote last edited by [email protected]Americans are not used to being in this position and are freezing in place. They tell themselves it’s “to fight” and to reclaim the country, but they ignore the reality that this could be a bleak path for ostensibly decades upon decades.
The lesson of 1933 is you get out. But lots of Americans won’t because they have never liked history or valued it.
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A bigot is a person who strongly and unfairly dislikes others based on their beliefs, race, or religion, often refusing to accept different ideas or groups. This term is commonly used to describe someone who holds prejudiced views.
Now that you know what the word means, try some self reflection.
wrote last edited by [email protected]Yeah and I haven't done any of those things. I made a pretty clear distinction between the subjects under a government and the government itself, i.e. people who live in Canada/America/wherever vs the Canadian/America/wherever government.
If hating the Canadian government is bigotry then bigotry is a toothless concept that needs to be dispensed with...but obviously, hating the Canadian government is not bigotry. It's an emotional continuation of a principled objection to all nations rooted in the anarchist tradition of anti-nationalist libertarian socialism. Hating the cultural institutions invented by the Canadian government isn't bigotry either. Again, it is an emotional continuation of a principled objection to nationalism, in particular the cultural assimilation
Actually, my argument is closer to "it is bigotry NOT to reject national governments and their cultural assimilation." Because these national governments assimilate whatever cultures they can distill into something acceptable for capitalism, and brutally destroy anyone who can't or won't be assimilated. THAT is bigotry.
Like there's this distinct sense that you came into this conversation to dunk on "dumb Americans" for being a "big dumb patriot in dumb USA why don't you just leave" and you didn't expect to be dealing to someone to your left because literally everyone in America is a conservative no exceptions allowed and literally no one is paying attention. Pay no mind to the LA anti-ICE protests and even the shitlib-controlled No Kings protests where about 1% of the population turned up (which is actually huge for protests!).
And since you're usually dunking on Americans, who often are actual bigots, as a Canadian in a marginally less shit society, your brain goes "Yeah this dude is American so he must be a bigot, call him a bigot, that'll show him."
You aren't debating me. You're dunking on this abstract idea of a generic American but writing it in prose with the length and cadence of a serious debate.
And to be clear: I love dunking on my fellow Americans. I really do. We need to be put in our fucking place from time to time...all the fucking time really.
What I don't appreciate is debating under false pretenses. It was really that first remark about racism where I knew what this conversation was: you were debating the generic American, not me, because it's obvious to anyone with a pulse that I had said nothing even remotely racist or controversial in the snippet you quoted.
Like you have every right to be mad at America and Americans but maybe don't dunk on Americans when they're trying to express their disdain for the things you claim to be against. Like I 1000% support an America boycott, not coming to America, not working with Americans, fuck us and fuck all our shit, but you gotta understand that 100% purely perfect boycotting of America is not possible for people who were born here. It's not even a remotely controversial position. To deny this is to deny material reality.
People accuse anarchists of black and white thinking but it's you who's thinking in black and white, specifically that it is easy for all Americans to leave America and that anymore who doesn't leave wants to be here and agrees with all or even any of the oppression that the US government has planned for the world.
And usually I don't keep hammering people like this but...come on...I know you're a debate lord. You're usually on the other side of this interaction...so it's a chance to understand how it feels to be on the other side. (And also maybe I have important shit to do that I'm too anxious to do right now
.)And you started all this over an extremely tame joke which, while literally going against the literal text of your first comment, clearly does not show support for the American empire or even diminish the correct anti-American critique you started with. I even gave you an out in the second comment where you could have said nothing or been like "well maybe I was a bit harsh".
All of this say: even if you were right, you're kind of being a jerk in your comment history. Not just to me, but to basically everyone you've interacted with lately. Not saying you are a jerk because I don't know you, but you're being a jerk. And if I wasn't such an insufferable jerk myself, I would have probably just told you that directly and moved on with my life. Game recognizes game
.Yeah I have lotsa bullshit to reflect on because I'm an extremely flawed human. Again, my post/comment history proves I have a lot of shit to work on, and I don't pretend otherwise. Now you know that you do too.
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Why isn't it that simple? People leave their countries for a better life everyday. If the situation is as bad as claimed I can see no reason why regardless of complexity it isn't the option chosen.
It isn’t simple. Most people I know who have moved to other countries hired an immigration attorney to help. It’s not cheap. Also, you can’t just show up in Canada and get a job. There is a legal process that must be followed. If you don’t have employment with a work visa ahead of time, you have to show proof you have the savings to live without working until you find a job to enter the country to look for work there. Many people don’t have months of expenses in an emergency account to lean on. Lots of impediments.
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It isn’t simple. Most people I know who have moved to other countries hired an immigration attorney to help. It’s not cheap. Also, you can’t just show up in Canada and get a job. There is a legal process that must be followed. If you don’t have employment with a work visa ahead of time, you have to show proof you have the savings to live without working until you find a job to enter the country to look for work there. Many people don’t have months of expenses in an emergency account to lean on. Lots of impediments.
It isn’t simple. Most people I know who have moved to other countries hired an immigration attorney to help. It’s not cheap. Also, you can’t just show up in Canada and get a job. There is a legal process that must be followed. If you don’t have employment with a work visa ahead of time, you have to show proof you have the savings to live without working until you find a job to enter the country to look for work there. Many people don’t have months of expenses in an emergency account to lean on. Lots of impediments.
Do you think any of this should matter to someone who needs to flee a country for their safety? Do you know how many people need to do such things on a regular basis? Why do you believe Americans are different?
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Yeah and I haven't done any of those things. I made a pretty clear distinction between the subjects under a government and the government itself, i.e. people who live in Canada/America/wherever vs the Canadian/America/wherever government.
If hating the Canadian government is bigotry then bigotry is a toothless concept that needs to be dispensed with...but obviously, hating the Canadian government is not bigotry. It's an emotional continuation of a principled objection to all nations rooted in the anarchist tradition of anti-nationalist libertarian socialism. Hating the cultural institutions invented by the Canadian government isn't bigotry either. Again, it is an emotional continuation of a principled objection to nationalism, in particular the cultural assimilation
Actually, my argument is closer to "it is bigotry NOT to reject national governments and their cultural assimilation." Because these national governments assimilate whatever cultures they can distill into something acceptable for capitalism, and brutally destroy anyone who can't or won't be assimilated. THAT is bigotry.
Like there's this distinct sense that you came into this conversation to dunk on "dumb Americans" for being a "big dumb patriot in dumb USA why don't you just leave" and you didn't expect to be dealing to someone to your left because literally everyone in America is a conservative no exceptions allowed and literally no one is paying attention. Pay no mind to the LA anti-ICE protests and even the shitlib-controlled No Kings protests where about 1% of the population turned up (which is actually huge for protests!).
And since you're usually dunking on Americans, who often are actual bigots, as a Canadian in a marginally less shit society, your brain goes "Yeah this dude is American so he must be a bigot, call him a bigot, that'll show him."
You aren't debating me. You're dunking on this abstract idea of a generic American but writing it in prose with the length and cadence of a serious debate.
And to be clear: I love dunking on my fellow Americans. I really do. We need to be put in our fucking place from time to time...all the fucking time really.
What I don't appreciate is debating under false pretenses. It was really that first remark about racism where I knew what this conversation was: you were debating the generic American, not me, because it's obvious to anyone with a pulse that I had said nothing even remotely racist or controversial in the snippet you quoted.
Like you have every right to be mad at America and Americans but maybe don't dunk on Americans when they're trying to express their disdain for the things you claim to be against. Like I 1000% support an America boycott, not coming to America, not working with Americans, fuck us and fuck all our shit, but you gotta understand that 100% purely perfect boycotting of America is not possible for people who were born here. It's not even a remotely controversial position. To deny this is to deny material reality.
People accuse anarchists of black and white thinking but it's you who's thinking in black and white, specifically that it is easy for all Americans to leave America and that anymore who doesn't leave wants to be here and agrees with all or even any of the oppression that the US government has planned for the world.
And usually I don't keep hammering people like this but...come on...I know you're a debate lord. You're usually on the other side of this interaction...so it's a chance to understand how it feels to be on the other side. (And also maybe I have important shit to do that I'm too anxious to do right now
.)And you started all this over an extremely tame joke which, while literally going against the literal text of your first comment, clearly does not show support for the American empire or even diminish the correct anti-American critique you started with. I even gave you an out in the second comment where you could have said nothing or been like "well maybe I was a bit harsh".
All of this say: even if you were right, you're kind of being a jerk in your comment history. Not just to me, but to basically everyone you've interacted with lately. Not saying you are a jerk because I don't know you, but you're being a jerk. And if I wasn't such an insufferable jerk myself, I would have probably just told you that directly and moved on with my life. Game recognizes game
.Yeah I have lotsa bullshit to reflect on because I'm an extremely flawed human. Again, my post/comment history proves I have a lot of shit to work on, and I don't pretend otherwise. Now you know that you do too.
Yeah and I haven’t done any of those things. I made a pretty clear distinction between the subjects under a government and the government itself, i.e. people who live in Canada/America/wherever vs the Canadian/America/wherever government.
You are making broad assumptions about the entire country of people which happens to be full of "Canadians" from different cultures. You assume anyone who isn't from a country attacked by the US (Which Canada currently is) does not get a say in the matter, and include everyone who isn't Indigenous or "Living in the inner city". (Racist, as I know who you are referencing here. Note: Many people from different backgrounds live in the "inner city" with many different experiences regardless of cultural origin.)
You ignore the fact that I am also from a visible minority group and lump me in with a group you know nothing about knowing nothing about me.
If hating the Canadian government is bigotry then bigotry is a toothless concept that needs to be dispensed with…but obviously, hating the Canadian government is not bigotry. It’s an emotional continuation of a principled objection to all nations rooted in the anarchist tradition of anti-nationalist libertarian socialism. Hating the cultural institutions invented by the Canadian government isn’t bigotry either. Again, it is an emotional continuation of a principled objection to nationalism, in particular the cultural assimilation
How do you feel about Indigenous Government structures?
You also aren't "hating on the Government" alone. You act as though Canada and Canadians don't have a unique culture and should be shamed for being proud of it. Yet you seem to think that people under other Governments, with other cultures, get more of a say in any conversation and should be proud of their cultures.
My people conquered and were conquered. We now have our own country after gaining independence from the Ottoman empire. Should my ancestral homeland be abolished?
Actually, my argument is closer to “it is bigotry NOT to reject national governments and their cultural assimilation.” Because these national governments assimilate whatever cultures they can distill into something acceptable for capitalism, and brutally destroy anyone who can’t or won’t be assimilated. THAT is bigotry.
In Canada we celebrate cultural days from all over the world. We have diasporas from all over the world. Everyone of them is as Canadian as the next, and we celebrate our cultural differences here.
Stop projecting your countries behavior on mine.
Like there’s this distinct sense that you came into this conversation to dunk on “dumb Americans” for being a “big dumb patriot in dumb USA why don’t you just leave” and you didn’t expect to be dealing to someone to your left because literally everyone in America is a conservative no exceptions allowed and literally no one is paying attention. Pay no mind to the LA anti-ICE protests and even the shitlib-controlled No Kings protests where about 1% of the population turned up (which is actually huge for protests!).
Nope. I came into this thread specifically to share a warning about your country.
Considering you are too lazy to scroll up:
The US is not safe to travel to and you do not have a legitimate reason to travel there now. Keep this in your mind regardless of what reason you think contradicts this. It is not safe.
It also doesn't matter if you are left or right because "dumb Americans" make up about 75% of your countries population. (21% are clinically illiterate, while a staggering 54% read at or below a 6th grade level making them functionally illiterate)
This leads to a massive problem when both sides of your political spectrum are clinically or functionally illiterate and unable to understand their own points.
And since you’re usually dunking on Americans, who often are actual bigots, as a Canadian in a marginally less shit society, your brain goes “Yeah this dude is American so he must be a bigot, call him a bigot, that’ll show him.”
I call a bigot when I see a bigot. I too have bigoted views that I accept and work to operate against. When you are being bigoted you will be called out for it. This includes bigotry towards people of European decent.
You aren’t debating me. You’re dunking on this abstract idea of a generic American but writing it in prose with the length and cadence of a serious debate.
I am not debating you, and it isn't because of an abstract generic idea. It is 100% because you don't have a real argument, and are being a bigot.
And to be clear: I love dunking on my fellow Americans. I really do. We need to be put in our fucking place from time to time…all the fucking time really.
You keep saying "dunking on" when it really is just "stating objective facts based on observation and data".
If you feel "dunked on" that might be a sign for self reflection.
What I don’t appreciate is debating under false pretenses. It was really that first remark about racism where I knew what this conversation was: you were debating the generic American, not me, because it’s obvious to anyone with a pulse that I had said nothing even remotely racist or controversial in the snippet you quoted.
Nope. It was all based on what you said. If you don't see it, that is on you not me.
Like you have every right to be mad at America and Americans but maybe don’t dunk on Americans when they’re trying to express their disdain for the things you claim to be against. Like I 1000% support an America boycott, not coming to America, not working with Americans, fuck us and fuck all our shit, but you gotta understand that 100% purely perfect boycotting of America is not possible for people who were born here. It’s not even a remotely controversial position. To deny this is to deny material reality.
To deny the fact that people from countries with real safety issues for the vast majority of the population don't have a choice to "ride it out". They were born there, had far less resources than you, and still fled for safety.
People accuse anarchists of black and white thinking but it’s you who’s thinking in black and white, specifically that it is easy for all Americans to leave America and that anymore who doesn’t leave wants to be here and agrees with all or even any of the oppression that the US government has planned for the world.
You can leave, fix your shit, or shut up about it when people impacted by your country are speaking. As I have already said.
And usually I don’t keep hammering people like this but…come on…I know you’re a debate lord. You’re usually on the other side of this interaction…so it’s a chance to understand how it feels to be on the other side. (And also maybe I have important shit to do that I’m too anxious to do right now
.)Not one word of this is true.
And you started all this over an extremely tame joke which, while literally going against the literal text of your first comment, clearly does not show support for the American empire or even diminish the correct anti-American critique you started with. I even gave you an out in the second comment where you could have said nothing or been like “well maybe I was a bit harsh”.
Maybe don't make jokes under a warning about peoples safety as a person who is partly responsible for aforementioned lack of safety. I also clearly stated why I proceeded the way I did. You didn't have to keep going but you did. I am responsible for my end, and you yours. It is on you just as much as me that we are here.
All of this say: even if you were right, you’re kind of being a jerk in your comment history. Not just to me, but to basically everyone you’ve interacted with lately. Not saying you are a jerk because I don’t know you, but you’re being a jerk. And if I wasn’t such an insufferable jerk myself, I would have probably just told you that directly and moved on with my life. Game recognizes game
.The delivery of information doesn't change whether it is correct or not. I have not been a jerk to basically everyone who I have interacted with, but I would love to see you waste your time by providing a chart that demonstrates me being an unwarranted jerk to the majority of people over 1.23k comments and 20 posts.
This shouldn't be too hard since you are already balls deep in my account. I expect it by the end of the week or your fired.
Yeah I have lotsa bullshit to reflect on because I’m an extremely flawed human. Again, my post/comment history proves I have a lot of shit to work on, and I don’t pretend otherwise. Now you know that you do too.
I never once claimed to be perfect, and I would be willing to bet big money on the fact that I am working harder on myself than the average person to be a better person daily.
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If I just delete all social media apps from my phone and pretend I don't have any social media accounts would these facist dumb fucks even know or would that seem suspicious?, I could just buy an extra phone but that seems a bit unnecessary
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Yeah and I haven’t done any of those things. I made a pretty clear distinction between the subjects under a government and the government itself, i.e. people who live in Canada/America/wherever vs the Canadian/America/wherever government.
You are making broad assumptions about the entire country of people which happens to be full of "Canadians" from different cultures. You assume anyone who isn't from a country attacked by the US (Which Canada currently is) does not get a say in the matter, and include everyone who isn't Indigenous or "Living in the inner city". (Racist, as I know who you are referencing here. Note: Many people from different backgrounds live in the "inner city" with many different experiences regardless of cultural origin.)
You ignore the fact that I am also from a visible minority group and lump me in with a group you know nothing about knowing nothing about me.
If hating the Canadian government is bigotry then bigotry is a toothless concept that needs to be dispensed with…but obviously, hating the Canadian government is not bigotry. It’s an emotional continuation of a principled objection to all nations rooted in the anarchist tradition of anti-nationalist libertarian socialism. Hating the cultural institutions invented by the Canadian government isn’t bigotry either. Again, it is an emotional continuation of a principled objection to nationalism, in particular the cultural assimilation
How do you feel about Indigenous Government structures?
You also aren't "hating on the Government" alone. You act as though Canada and Canadians don't have a unique culture and should be shamed for being proud of it. Yet you seem to think that people under other Governments, with other cultures, get more of a say in any conversation and should be proud of their cultures.
My people conquered and were conquered. We now have our own country after gaining independence from the Ottoman empire. Should my ancestral homeland be abolished?
Actually, my argument is closer to “it is bigotry NOT to reject national governments and their cultural assimilation.” Because these national governments assimilate whatever cultures they can distill into something acceptable for capitalism, and brutally destroy anyone who can’t or won’t be assimilated. THAT is bigotry.
In Canada we celebrate cultural days from all over the world. We have diasporas from all over the world. Everyone of them is as Canadian as the next, and we celebrate our cultural differences here.
Stop projecting your countries behavior on mine.
Like there’s this distinct sense that you came into this conversation to dunk on “dumb Americans” for being a “big dumb patriot in dumb USA why don’t you just leave” and you didn’t expect to be dealing to someone to your left because literally everyone in America is a conservative no exceptions allowed and literally no one is paying attention. Pay no mind to the LA anti-ICE protests and even the shitlib-controlled No Kings protests where about 1% of the population turned up (which is actually huge for protests!).
Nope. I came into this thread specifically to share a warning about your country.
Considering you are too lazy to scroll up:
The US is not safe to travel to and you do not have a legitimate reason to travel there now. Keep this in your mind regardless of what reason you think contradicts this. It is not safe.
It also doesn't matter if you are left or right because "dumb Americans" make up about 75% of your countries population. (21% are clinically illiterate, while a staggering 54% read at or below a 6th grade level making them functionally illiterate)
This leads to a massive problem when both sides of your political spectrum are clinically or functionally illiterate and unable to understand their own points.
And since you’re usually dunking on Americans, who often are actual bigots, as a Canadian in a marginally less shit society, your brain goes “Yeah this dude is American so he must be a bigot, call him a bigot, that’ll show him.”
I call a bigot when I see a bigot. I too have bigoted views that I accept and work to operate against. When you are being bigoted you will be called out for it. This includes bigotry towards people of European decent.
You aren’t debating me. You’re dunking on this abstract idea of a generic American but writing it in prose with the length and cadence of a serious debate.
I am not debating you, and it isn't because of an abstract generic idea. It is 100% because you don't have a real argument, and are being a bigot.
And to be clear: I love dunking on my fellow Americans. I really do. We need to be put in our fucking place from time to time…all the fucking time really.
You keep saying "dunking on" when it really is just "stating objective facts based on observation and data".
If you feel "dunked on" that might be a sign for self reflection.
What I don’t appreciate is debating under false pretenses. It was really that first remark about racism where I knew what this conversation was: you were debating the generic American, not me, because it’s obvious to anyone with a pulse that I had said nothing even remotely racist or controversial in the snippet you quoted.
Nope. It was all based on what you said. If you don't see it, that is on you not me.
Like you have every right to be mad at America and Americans but maybe don’t dunk on Americans when they’re trying to express their disdain for the things you claim to be against. Like I 1000% support an America boycott, not coming to America, not working with Americans, fuck us and fuck all our shit, but you gotta understand that 100% purely perfect boycotting of America is not possible for people who were born here. It’s not even a remotely controversial position. To deny this is to deny material reality.
To deny the fact that people from countries with real safety issues for the vast majority of the population don't have a choice to "ride it out". They were born there, had far less resources than you, and still fled for safety.
People accuse anarchists of black and white thinking but it’s you who’s thinking in black and white, specifically that it is easy for all Americans to leave America and that anymore who doesn’t leave wants to be here and agrees with all or even any of the oppression that the US government has planned for the world.
You can leave, fix your shit, or shut up about it when people impacted by your country are speaking. As I have already said.
And usually I don’t keep hammering people like this but…come on…I know you’re a debate lord. You’re usually on the other side of this interaction…so it’s a chance to understand how it feels to be on the other side. (And also maybe I have important shit to do that I’m too anxious to do right now
.)Not one word of this is true.
And you started all this over an extremely tame joke which, while literally going against the literal text of your first comment, clearly does not show support for the American empire or even diminish the correct anti-American critique you started with. I even gave you an out in the second comment where you could have said nothing or been like “well maybe I was a bit harsh”.
Maybe don't make jokes under a warning about peoples safety as a person who is partly responsible for aforementioned lack of safety. I also clearly stated why I proceeded the way I did. You didn't have to keep going but you did. I am responsible for my end, and you yours. It is on you just as much as me that we are here.
All of this say: even if you were right, you’re kind of being a jerk in your comment history. Not just to me, but to basically everyone you’ve interacted with lately. Not saying you are a jerk because I don’t know you, but you’re being a jerk. And if I wasn’t such an insufferable jerk myself, I would have probably just told you that directly and moved on with my life. Game recognizes game
.The delivery of information doesn't change whether it is correct or not. I have not been a jerk to basically everyone who I have interacted with, but I would love to see you waste your time by providing a chart that demonstrates me being an unwarranted jerk to the majority of people over 1.23k comments and 20 posts.
This shouldn't be too hard since you are already balls deep in my account. I expect it by the end of the week or your fired.
Yeah I have lotsa bullshit to reflect on because I’m an extremely flawed human. Again, my post/comment history proves I have a lot of shit to work on, and I don’t pretend otherwise. Now you know that you do too.
I never once claimed to be perfect, and I would be willing to bet big money on the fact that I am working harder on myself than the average person to be a better person daily.
You are making broad assumptions about the entire country of people which happens to be full of "Canadians" from different cultures.
Almost. I am making broad assumptions about people who positively identify with Canada because these are assumptions that, by identifying with and defending Canada's legacy, you self-associate yourself with. Obviously Canada is a diverse place. Canada even has anarchist federations! But when you choose to identify with the culture of the oppressor, I can freely use the assumptions, which that culture has spent so much time, money, and blood forcing to be the reality, about you.
You assume anyone who isn't from a country attacked by the US (Which Canada currently is)
Canada is not being attacked by the US. Yeah they're tariffing goods coming out of your country and they're harassing and detained Canadians at the border, but you aren't being militarily attacked.
does not get a say in the matter, ...
No I'm not weighting whether or not you get a say at all, I'm weighting the amount of patience I give people for saying things that are incorrect, bigoted, or wrong in any way. And it's not strictly being bombed by the US that's the condition: it's the person's material circumstances, what kind of danger they're in, mental state.
It's not even remotely unreasonable to be more patient with people who are going through hard times or are in distress.
and include everyone who isn't Indigenous or "Living in the inner city". (Racist, as I know who you are referencing here. Note: Many people from different backgrounds live in the "inner city" with many different experiences regardless of cultural origin.)
The wording I used was "even on the reservations or in the inner city" about people who I would have more patience with based on their location and material circumstances. Of course race is a huge part of that! And it's not racist to acknowledge that! But it's not the only part. For example, there are some black and brown people raised in suburban areas who are quite well off and adopt similar positions to the capitalist monoculture. For these people, I would have a lower patience compared to black and brown people living in the inner city or out in the country who are statistically more likely to be fighting harder than me against the system to survive. Similarly, there are a minority of white people raised in the inner city for whom I would have a higher patience than white people living in the suburbs, because even though white people have not faced a history of race-based discrimination, some white people continue to experience discrimination for their class, gender, sexuality, sometimes even their ethnicity (example: Irish, Italians, Jews).
Acknowledging the reality that people of different races are treated differently and thus are dealing with different circumstances is not racism! It's anti-racism! Get with the program!
Furthermore, inner cities in particular are marred by police violence and structural oppression. Some of that oppression is experienced invariantly with respect to race by anyone living in the inner city.
Like I was very clearly referring to people living in these locations, and I wanted to encode the subtlety that living in these locations can actually be to your detriment.
You ignore the fact that I am also from a visible minority group and lump me in with a group you know nothing about knowing nothing about me.
Canadians are not a minority in Canada. I actually don't know about if you are from any other minority groups. I didn't really get that far in your profile.
How do you feel about Indigenous Government structures?
No one is free until we're all free. I am a settler and I'm not an expert on Indigenous governing structures, which is admittedly a blind spot. Otherwise, I defer to Indigenous voices about Indigenous issues. For an Indigenous anarchist perspective, see the "Indigenous Sovereignty" section of the following article for a much more subtle discussion about the topic than I could possibly give right now. Yes, even anarchists have problems with settler colonialism, myself included despite my best efforts.
https://journals.uvic.ca/index.php/adcs/article/download/20169/8928/
Alternatively, if you have some reading material about Indigenous sovereignty I'd love to check it out. Anecdotally, I have noticed the rise of a very careful Indigenous Anarchist current since the resistance to the Dakota Access Pipeline gained traction.
(Continued in reply.)
-
You are making broad assumptions about the entire country of people which happens to be full of "Canadians" from different cultures.
Almost. I am making broad assumptions about people who positively identify with Canada because these are assumptions that, by identifying with and defending Canada's legacy, you self-associate yourself with. Obviously Canada is a diverse place. Canada even has anarchist federations! But when you choose to identify with the culture of the oppressor, I can freely use the assumptions, which that culture has spent so much time, money, and blood forcing to be the reality, about you.
You assume anyone who isn't from a country attacked by the US (Which Canada currently is)
Canada is not being attacked by the US. Yeah they're tariffing goods coming out of your country and they're harassing and detained Canadians at the border, but you aren't being militarily attacked.
does not get a say in the matter, ...
No I'm not weighting whether or not you get a say at all, I'm weighting the amount of patience I give people for saying things that are incorrect, bigoted, or wrong in any way. And it's not strictly being bombed by the US that's the condition: it's the person's material circumstances, what kind of danger they're in, mental state.
It's not even remotely unreasonable to be more patient with people who are going through hard times or are in distress.
and include everyone who isn't Indigenous or "Living in the inner city". (Racist, as I know who you are referencing here. Note: Many people from different backgrounds live in the "inner city" with many different experiences regardless of cultural origin.)
The wording I used was "even on the reservations or in the inner city" about people who I would have more patience with based on their location and material circumstances. Of course race is a huge part of that! And it's not racist to acknowledge that! But it's not the only part. For example, there are some black and brown people raised in suburban areas who are quite well off and adopt similar positions to the capitalist monoculture. For these people, I would have a lower patience compared to black and brown people living in the inner city or out in the country who are statistically more likely to be fighting harder than me against the system to survive. Similarly, there are a minority of white people raised in the inner city for whom I would have a higher patience than white people living in the suburbs, because even though white people have not faced a history of race-based discrimination, some white people continue to experience discrimination for their class, gender, sexuality, sometimes even their ethnicity (example: Irish, Italians, Jews).
Acknowledging the reality that people of different races are treated differently and thus are dealing with different circumstances is not racism! It's anti-racism! Get with the program!
Furthermore, inner cities in particular are marred by police violence and structural oppression. Some of that oppression is experienced invariantly with respect to race by anyone living in the inner city.
Like I was very clearly referring to people living in these locations, and I wanted to encode the subtlety that living in these locations can actually be to your detriment.
You ignore the fact that I am also from a visible minority group and lump me in with a group you know nothing about knowing nothing about me.
Canadians are not a minority in Canada. I actually don't know about if you are from any other minority groups. I didn't really get that far in your profile.
How do you feel about Indigenous Government structures?
No one is free until we're all free. I am a settler and I'm not an expert on Indigenous governing structures, which is admittedly a blind spot. Otherwise, I defer to Indigenous voices about Indigenous issues. For an Indigenous anarchist perspective, see the "Indigenous Sovereignty" section of the following article for a much more subtle discussion about the topic than I could possibly give right now. Yes, even anarchists have problems with settler colonialism, myself included despite my best efforts.
https://journals.uvic.ca/index.php/adcs/article/download/20169/8928/
Alternatively, if you have some reading material about Indigenous sovereignty I'd love to check it out. Anecdotally, I have noticed the rise of a very careful Indigenous Anarchist current since the resistance to the Dakota Access Pipeline gained traction.
(Continued in reply.)
wrote last edited by [email protected]Not one word of this is true.
Come on. I know a debate lord when I see one. Game recognizes game. The problem with being a debate lord is that there's always a bigger debate lord than you
.Maybe don't make jokes
Socialism is when no jokes /s
...under a warning about peoples safety as a person who is partly responsible for aforementioned lack of safety.
Oh my fucking God no I am not partly responsible for the lack of safety that the US government imposes on its citizens. The US GOVERNMENT is causally responsible, and the fault lies with the people who run the system and the capitalists who are responsible for it. The State imposes this reality on me and almost everyone else here. We NEVER had a democracy, even de jure! The United States is a "democratic" republic! And every step of the way, I have expressed my disgust for this evil country and its trajectory!
Please if you take home only one message, it is this: States IMPOSE their will upon the working class.
And again, what I said did not even go against your warning. It didn't even diminish the engagement your warning got. It probably got a few people more people to read it because there was an actual discussion below it.
And if you thought what I said was insensitive, you could have clearly stated so. But again... this is my reality too, that I'm fucking stuck in this sick fucking hellhole. I feel like I have a right to make jokes at my own expense.
The delivery of information doesn't change whether it is correct or not.
Right, that's why I put it in a separate part of the comment separated by a line. But also... that's not how humans operate? If you want people to listen to you, in general you can't be a jerk about it. That's something you'll learn as you unlearn debate lord habits.
I have not been a jerk to basically everyone who I have interacted with, but I would love to see you waste your time by providing a chart that demonstrates me being an unwarranted jerk to the majority of people over 1.23k comments and 20 posts.
I mean "being a jerk" is an opinion, so it's not something you can really do reliable mathematics about, i.e. a chart would be equivalent to what I have already given you in text form. A chart actually would have been faster to make, i.e. it would be less of a waste of time.
More precisely: you've been being a jerk to people on Lemmy with the account I'm replying to. I don't think you're necessarily a jerk anywhere else. This isn't a personal attack. I'm commenting on your behavior.
This shouldn't be too hard since you are already balls deep in my account. I expect it by the end of the week or your fired.
Nah I'm not that deep in your profile lol, and I'm not even good at reading people. Just a week or two to get a sense of where you're coming from.
I also clearly stated why I proceeded the way I did.
I agree to disagree.
You didn't have to keep going but you did.
Yup. I'm not a debate lord. I'm a debate monster
.I am responsible for my end, and you yours. It is on you just as much as me that we are here.
Hell yeah I'm riding this train wherever it goesEdit: Actually I'm not gonna respond to any responses to the previous two responses because I've made my points and the rational side of me is realizing that this is getting a bit excessive. Not that I can't, but because I'm seeing myself get back into those debate lord behaviors I loathe so much.
.So genuinely: beyond this point, I can agree to disagree with you, I apologize for not dropping it earlier, and have a nice rest of your week.
