Gustavo Petro responds to Trump: “Overthrow me…the Americas and humanity will respond”

[flyingsquid@lemmy.world]

Are you going to argue that Trump isn't a Nazi now?

[qyron@sopuli.xyz]

After calling the entire current american cabinet fascist a few times in previous replies, doing that would be, at the least, intelectually dishonest.

That part is already well defined.

What I want to know, from you, is who is negotiating with them.

[flyingsquid@lemmy.world]

Petro saying military planes can't deport citizens to Colombia but nonmilitary planes can in order to get the tariff threat removed is a negotiation.

[moon@lemmy.ml]

Disappointing but understandable since the reports are saying other government officials, including his foreign secretary had to step in. I'm sure the argument that his personal reputation or issues with Trump destroying the Colombian economy was compelling enough

[qyron@sopuli.xyz]

That's funny.

I remember reading the push was over the US deporting colombians, on military plains, handcuffed, as if they were prisoners of war.

El Chato threats - and announces - tariffs in retaliation of Colombia not accepting such flights.

Colombia sends their presidencial airplane to ferry the deportees - to my understanding, this is akin to retrieving POWs - after which Chato Cheetah balks and the military flights are replaced by civilian freight.

Win for Colombia. They get their people back, in humane conditions.

The fascists can still turn back on these terms, granted, but then it will be back to the beggining, with the threat of commercial tariffs, etc. Colombia goes back to sending their planes to pick up their people.

What else do you want?

Colombia to abandon their people on unfriendly foreign soil?

[chairmanmeow@programming.dev]

No, his position has always been that the US could send migrants back, but it had to be done humanely. Petro objected to the military transports with underfed and cuffed people in it (same thing Brazil is complaining about). It's also why he sent the presidential plane to pick up migrants in a humane way instead.

After that Trump threw his hissy-fit and threatened tarriffs, Colombia reiterated that it only needs people to be taken care of properly and treated like people, and the US caved to those (imo very reasonable) demands.

Ofc Trump bullshits his way through what should normally be a political humiliation, but here we are.

[chairmanmeow@programming.dev]

That article doesn't contradict what he said.

From the article:

“I cannot force migrants to remain in a country that does not want them. But if that country returns them, it must be with dignity and respect – for both them and our nation. In civilian planes, and without treating them like criminals, we will welcome our compatriots. Colombia deserves respect.”

The Trump admin explanation doesn't line up with the timeline of events.

[recreationalcatheter@lemm.ee]

I did, it has since been rescinded.

[recreationalcatheter@lemm.ee]

Wow, a lot of people emotionally disagree with that quote. You can tell because 30+ down voted and you maybe see 1 of them commenting to take a stance.

Cowards who are afraid of reality deserve no respect.

[flyingsquid@lemmy.world]

It won't be done humanely regardless and I have no idea why people think it will. That's my biggest issue here. Trusting a Nazi to keep his word.

[flyingsquid@lemmy.world]

What else do I want? Nazis to not ethnically cleanse? But I'm gathering that I am in a minority here unfortunately.

[cypherpunks@lemmy.ml]

Wow, a lot of people emotionally disagree with that quote. You can tell because 30+ down voted and you maybe see 1 of them commenting to take a stance.

Cowards who are afraid of reality deserve no respect.

Maybe... it got all those downvotes because it was a ridiculous thing to post in reply to an article which is simply reporting facts without any bias whatsoever, and posting that comment here in this context appears to be an attempt at discrediting Petro (who is, in fact... a leftist ...watch out) in response to his standing up to to Trump?

And maybe all those other people downvoting it didn't bother replying because I had already posted my reply (which adequately pointed out the absurdity of it) right after the comment was posted?

[zalgotext@sh.itjust.works]

Brother what else is Colombia supposed to do to prevent an ethnic cleanse in an unfriendly state, other than sending planes to rescue their people from that state? Do you want them to declare war on the United States or what?

[cypherpunks@lemmy.ml]

I used that link to look up the source. It wasn’t here so I posted it here. I do the same with archive links.

Do you post MBFC links on articles from outlets they classify as "unbiased" too, or just the "biased" ones?

As others have pointed out many times before, the entirely flawed premise behind MBFC is that centrism correlates with credibility and/or factualness.

I didn’t report this and don’t have a problem with it.

cool

In general, the fact that they don’t disclose the country they operate out of is problematic

Who doesn't disclose where People Dispatch operates out of? MBFC? Yeah, they don't, because they're lazy hacks who's job it is to impugn the reputation of anyone doing any journalism that isn't in service of the status quo.

since we can’t know if they’re operating from a place where telling the truth is illegal.

A couple minutes of research shows that (although their contributors are all over the world) their legal entity People's Dispatch Ltd. is registered in New York. So, I guess actually you might be on to something here

Edit: I should also say that it’s important they’ve never failed a fact check. I don’t really care about them having editorial bias as long as we know what it is.

The notion that any outlet could have no bias in what they decide is and isn't worthy of reporting on, especially the people MBFC says are unbiased, is ridiculous. And it's usually not difficult to see what an outlet's bias is without relying on a 3rd party using their own bias to classify someone else's.

[flyingsquid@lemmy.world]

Now there's an idea. Do what the U.S. did to them.

[qyron@sopuli.xyz]

I've spent a good time of my day going back and forward with you exactly because I want to understand with you keep defending Colombia cooperated with fascists when they did not.

They had people there, in need of help, in the hands of very bad actors.

What were their options? Abandon those people? Become as bad as the fascists in the process? Worst, in my view. A fascist is an enemy, someone who abandons their kin is a traitor of the worst kind.

What was Colombia supposed to do, in your view? Give me a straighforward answer, not a circular comeback as you have been giving. Blurting you do not want nazis to ethnic cleanse is not an answer to my question.

The fascist american regime (not Nazi; that was the late National Socialist Party of Germany) is currently expelling foreigners by force. I am sure many have already died but we are not seeing mass graves and killings of elements of certain population groups. Be intellectualy honest, please. I am engaging in good faith.

No one here is saying they support that cadre of criminals. No one is attacking you or your position.

[flyingsquid@lemmy.world]

I was pretty sure I gave you a straight answer multiple times, but apparently everything I say is wrong lately, so I guess this is just one of all of those times.

[qyron@sopuli.xyz]

That was unnecessarily cruel towards yourself.

Have I been engaging you in bad faith? Have I resorted to insult or personal attack? If so, that was uncalled for and I sincerely apologize.

[flyingsquid@lemmy.world]

You won't accept my answer so obviously my answer is wrong as usual.

[qyron@sopuli.xyz]

Because I don't see this exchange as win/lose situation I can only state, again, that I find your statement unnecessarily cruel towards yourself.